UAV violations, what's YOUR stand?

Dealer of Death · Aug 14th 2021, 9:19pm

So in my Mobile game, a dude flies 2 of his UAVs right into the heart of my territory and hovers above my cities checking out my troops. I naturally declare war and shot one of them out of the sky. Then he asks me if we are cool????

I know what the Wiki says, "UAVs don't declare war" when crossing into non friendly airspace, but in my book, anytime you even graze reveal my lands with UAVs, I'm declaring on you.

What is you guys opinions on this?

Teburu · Aug 14th 2021, 9:31pm

unless im severely underprepared (for whatever reasons) im totally gonna go for that guy
cuz lets be honest, he wouldn't be in my airspace if he came in peace, instead he'll leave in pieces

KFGauss · Aug 14th 2021, 11:07pm

As a public game UAV user, I'll point out that if you aren't in the same coalition as the UAV owner, the two of you are at war already, starting at hour zero of day one - "There can be only one."

The only question is when you're going to start shooting.

If you're ready to start shooting when the UAV flies over, go ahead.

If you consider that the UAV might be flying lots of places to keep an eye on all neighbors, then you might want to spend a little time preparing for the active shooting part of your war, instead of letting the UAV trigger it.

For example, there's a decent chance the UAV owner is going entangle him/herself with some other country, maybe a different one that also dislikes seeing a UAV overhead. If that happens you can probably catch them with their pants down during those engagements, and see how well they do with a two-front war.

Aside from biding your time (above), another possible response is sending your UAV over their territory. What's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.

Or, like you described above, you can attack immediately, on a timetable tied to their plans instead of your own, which might be what they wanted to trick you into doing.

Granted, many public-game players aren't very tricky, but some are.

KFG

Dealer of Death · Aug 15th 2021, 2:08am

KFGauss wrote:

As a public game UAV user, I'll point out that if you aren't in the same coalition as the UAV owner, the two of you are at war already, starting at hour zero of day one - "There can be only one."

The only question is when you're going to start shooting.

If you're ready to start shooting when the UAV flies over, go ahead.

If you consider that the UAV might be flying lots of places to keep an eye on all neighbors, then you might want to spend a little time preparing for the active shooting part of your war, instead of letting the UAV trigger it.

For example, there's a decent chance the UAV owner is going entangle him/herself with some other country, maybe a different one that also dislikes seeing a UAV overhead. If that happens you can probably catch them with their pants down during those engagements, and see how well they do with a two-front war.

Aside from biding your time (above), another possible response is sending your UAV over their territory. What's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.

Or, like you described above, you can attack immediately, on a timetable tied to their plans instead of your own, which might be what they wanted to trick you into doing.

Granted, many public-game players aren't very tricky, but some are.

KFG

I hardly think it was at all according to their plans, or that they expected frigates in the Great Lakes. No, I think he just saw a noob and thought he could get away with it since my Mobile account is UserXXXXX and only level 2 in Rank.

Dealer of Death · Aug 15th 2021, 2:10am

KFGauss wrote:

As a public game UAV user, I'll point out that if you aren't in the same coalition as the UAV owner, the two of you are at war already, starting at hour zero of day one - "There can be only one."

...

KFG

It is utterly amazing how many people don't realize they are playing a war game. "But I didn't attack you" "Why are you attacking me?" etc. etc.

Opulon · Aug 15th 2021, 2:50am

I generally agree with all of you.

CoN is not a game very deep in diplomacy. We are not in the same coalition, or your coalition is 5 players on 5 players ? It means we are already in a "prey"/"hunter" relationship.

This doesn't mean we can't be cordial, but i wouldn't be surprised to be attacked, so... the other side shouldn't be either. UAV are scouts. You don't scout if you are not considering war, one way or another.

KFGauss · Aug 15th 2021, 6:43am

Dealer of Death wrote:

KFGauss wrote:

...

I hardly think it was at all according to their plans, or that they expected frigates in the Great Lakes. No, I think he just saw a noob and thought he could get away with it since my Mobile account is UserXXXXX and only level 2 in Rank.

Sure & OK - You do you (No snark intended).

This definitely isn't a topic I would die in the ditch debating. When I fly my UAVs, I know I'm taking chances.

My long-winded post earlier was just some reasons for thinking of the situation as something other than an either-or binary choice.

As @Opulon strongly implied, there is a 3rd way to react (and a 4th and a ...).

If I'm not playing for a solo win, unless and until the alliance is full, I like to at least exchange a message or two before starting shooting.

Sometimes the other player surprises you by having their head screwed on semi-straight, or is a rookie worth nurturing a bit (to try to turn them into a repeat players). In either of those cases, the other person can become your next coalition member. Other times, not so much.

gojiramike · Aug 15th 2021, 9:54am

When a UAV flies over my territory I take it down because it's an act of war in my book.

ZDude666 · Aug 15th 2021, 2:13pm

I would also just shoot it down.

They would not fly UAVs if they aren't planning to attack, so I might as well just shoot it down and get him unexpectedly.

Even if the UAV doesn't declare war, I still very much consider it as an act of war.

WalterChang · Aug 15th 2021, 3:16pm

Dealer of Death wrote:

So in my Mobile game, a dude flies 2 of his UAVs right into the heart of my territory and hovers above my cities checking out my troops. I naturally declare war and shot one of them out of the sky.

I agree with you about this. I would do the same.

Dealer of Death wrote:

I know what the Wiki says, "UAVs don't declare war" when crossing into non friendly airspace, but in my book, anytime you even graze reveal my lands with UAVs, I'm declaring on you.

But I don't agree with that. Overflying my homeland cities is a no-no - I'm not going to let someone do that. But if they're just checking out the front line on occupied territory, then I'd probably let it go. I might send some fighters up to shadow them, and hopefully that sends the message that they shouldn't push their luck, but I'm not going to instantly declare war just for that.

Dealer of Death · Aug 15th 2021, 3:22pm

KFGauss wrote:

Dealer of Death wrote:

KFGauss wrote:

...

I hardly think it was at all according to their plans, or that they expected frigates in the Great Lakes. No, I think he just saw a noob and thought he could get away with it since my Mobile account is UserXXXXX and only level 2 in Rank.

Sure & OK - You do you (No snark intended).
This definitely isn't a topic I would die in the ditch debating. When I fly my UAVs, I know I'm taking chances.

My long-winded post earlier was just some reasons for thinking of the situation as something other than an either-or binary choice.

As @Opulon strongly implied, there is a 3rd way to react (and a 4th and a ...).

If I'm not playing for a solo win, unless and until the alliance is full, I like to at least exchange a message or two before starting shooting.

Sometimes the other player surprises you by having their head screwed on semi-straight, or is a rookie worth nurturing a bit (to try to turn them into a repeat players). In either of those cases, the other person can become your next coalition member. Other times, not so much.

I understand you have your own quaint view, and while I agree, some noobs can be reasoned with and helped, I'm much ore likely to take one under my wing and help them if they outright come at me and attack me, than spying on me. Spying is dishonorable. It is cheating honor, performing war without declaring war.

Hydralysk · Aug 15th 2021, 11:03pm

Dealer of Death wrote:

Spying is dishonorable. It is cheating honor, performing war without declaring war.

Last time I looked, spying was defined as "the secret gathering of information on others "
Ain't nothing secret about a UAV.
They are about as blatant as you can get.

Dealer of Death · Aug 15th 2021, 11:48pm

Hydralysk wrote:

Dealer of Death wrote:

Spying is dishonorable. It is cheating honor, performing war without declaring war.

Last time I looked, spying was defined as "the secret gathering of information on others "Ain't nothing secret about a UAV.
They are about as blatant as you can get.

Spying can also be defined as "the gathering of secret information on others" and that's what my troop dispositions are, secret information, hence, the UAV is spying.

The U-2 aircraft were most certainly spy planes, even when the Russians knew exactly where they were.

WalterChang · Aug 16th 2021, 12:16am

Dealer of Death wrote:

The U-2 aircraft were most certainly spy planes, even when the Russians knew exactly where they were.

Would you say the use of U-2s was dishonourable?

Dealer of Death · Aug 16th 2021, 12:54am

WalterChang wrote:

Dealer of Death wrote:

The U-2 aircraft were most certainly spy planes, even when the Russians knew exactly where they were.

Would you say the use of U-2s was dishonourable?

From a strict interpretation, yes, probably. However, like the rest of History written by the winners, I'd say it's kinda only dishonorable if you get caught.

Hydralysk · Aug 16th 2021, 1:16am

Dealer of Death wrote:

Spying can also be defined as "the gathering of secret information on others" .

Interesting. Your reference source for that definition is?

Dealer of Death · Aug 16th 2021, 1:30am

Hydralysk wrote:

Dealer of Death wrote:

Spying can also be defined as "the gathering of secret information on others" .

Interesting. Your reference source for that definition is?

Espionage or spying is the act of obtaining secret or confidential information from non-disclosed sources or divulging of the same without the permission of the holder of the information.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Espionage

Only the most easy source on the entire Internet.

Hydralysk · Aug 16th 2021, 3:06am

Thank you for providing your source.

You did read of course that the definition includes the caveat that "The practice is clandestine.", right?
Which as I understand it, means that it is not out in the open for everyone to see.

Again, UAV flights are about as obvious as they get.

Opulon · Aug 16th 2021, 3:33am

except when you get them to stealth, which you honestly should because they become more than useful

KFGauss · Aug 16th 2021, 3:35am

"Quaint"?

That's a word you don't hear often, particularly from a Dealer of Death.

It seems vaguely insulting.

Now I have a sad.

Oh well... It's only a game, even the biggest fish among us is only swimming in a teeny pond. I suppose I'll survive. :thumbup:

Sad is gone. :thumbsup:

Time for fun again.

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