Research priorities

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    • imo you don’t need the perfect intel uav provides like 8/10 times you can make pretty accurate guesses about stackcomposition based on their buildings and newspaper
      uav also needs a lot more micro cuz you only cover like 50 range
      radar covers far more and doesnt need that much micro to begin with
      I am The Baseline for opinions

    • Nahh, in public you really don't need radars or UAV's at all.
      Just always take more land away from the city. Let the enemy come to youṛ territory. You'll see everything he has. He will be slow. If he tries to take it with single unit just bomb it with arty or strike fighters/helicopters.
      You can check his buildings and CON news and you'll not be surprised.

      Other than that use scouts on mountains or ASF if enemy has coastal cities and he is transporting by the sea.
      Either way you'll see exact composition of his troops.
      Some cities are close to borders, ideal to check enemy composition and lvl.
      Lvl is even more important because you can see where is he going with research.

      And always use alfa strike as tactics. Attack first if you can. Unprovoked surprise, why not. If he is strong enemy near you, maybe already in full coalition... Just deal with him before others can come to help him.
      They will probably ask you to join after that :rolleyes:
      .
      But don't expose what you have.
      Eg. If you have canons or strike fighters as alfa damage dealers, don't use them to finish AI because it will be in news. Hide what you have as much as possible.

      The key is to react before conflict occurs. Eg. If you se a lot of airports some higher lvl, just rush combined AA. If you see a lot of baracks, some high lvl and in news armor divisions, build anti armor units.

      Why would you need radars or UAV's in public?

    • Zemunelo wrote:

      Nahh, in public you really don't need radars or UAV's at all.
      Just always take more land away from the city. Let the enemy come to youṛ territory. You'll see everything he has. He will be slow. If he tries to take it with single unit just bomb it with arty or strike fighters/helicopters.
      You can check his buildings and CON news and you'll not be surprised.

      Other than that use scouts on mountains or ASF if enemy has coastal cities and he is transporting by the sea.
      Either way you'll see exact composition of his troops.
      Some cities are close to borders, ideal to check enemy composition and lvl.
      Lvl is even more important because you can see where is he going with research.

      And always use alfa strike as tactics. Attack first if you can. Unprovoked surprise, why not. If he is strong enemy near you, maybe already in full coalition... Just deal with him before others can come to help him.
      They will probably ask you to join after that :rolleyes:
      .
      But don't expose what you have.
      Eg. If you have canons or strike fighters as alfa damage dealers, don't use them to finish AI because it will be in news. Hide what you have as much as possible.

      The key is to react before conflict occurs. Eg. If you se a lot of airports some higher lvl, just rush combined AA. If you see a lot of baracks, some high lvl and in news armor divisions, build anti armor units.

      Why would you need radars or UAV's in public?
      What now? Let them come to you or strike them first? You do not seem so sure yourself.


      Radar help me keeping everything under control. With a radar I exactly know which provinces are free and up for grabs and which are needed to get cleared out first.
      Without a radar I could run everywhere into a possible fight and risk unnecessary losses.
      A radar also tells me, where he has his aircrafts patroling so maybe I can make a sneak take down with my SAMs.

      Not sure how you even want to alpha strike if you do not know exact positions of hostile troops. :whistling:
      Also if you mean specs with scouts it is pretty much the same as a UAV, just the ground version, so you are using 'UAV' yourself.

    • You are entirely right, and to be honest, in my alliance (and i suspect that it's the same in all developed alliances), when we recruit peoples, there is always a long period of time where we delicately need to change some bad habits, or some misplaced confidence in some behaviours, into more refined "martial arts".

      It takes time, it needs to be done slowly, because those bad habits come from something that nobody can't really argue with : It works.

      When you have played only public games all your "CoN"-life, only a few have the capacity to understand spontanously that they have developed their muscles and their abilities to become "specialists" at farming noobs.

      And so, when one encounters trained players merely once every 30-40 games MAX, they often disregard this "one over 40" as "man, he was playing with mass gold ! There's no way something that made me win 39 games lost so badly against someone that plays legitimately".

      But in fact, it's entirely what happens. One good spectacular example would be the typical "My army is 90% Strike fighters/heavy bombers", that you see often in flashpoint or 4X.

      This guy DEVASTATES 90% of players with a 3 K/D, easy peasy. And then, he falls against someone that is active and uses properly SAM/ASF synergy. The Guy then IS devastated with a 7 K/D easy peasy. I remember very precisely one of those occurences where a man was playing JAPAN and didn't bother with a navy, he made 80 strike fighters, dominated all of asia, until he lost everything in 30 minutes against an ally and me because we had OF COURSE put frigates around his homeland city. he tried to fly all his strike fighters at once into the frigates, and lose everything in a matter of a few AA rounds.

      Of course he was stupid, of course he could have seen it coming from 5 000 km, but he didn't, because ultimately, he was 3 K/D ratio, and won a good chunk of his maps. He of course alleviated his frustration by calling us cheaters.

      In alliances, we do force ourselves to play things that, at the first approach, are less efficient and less quick to kill noobs, but that are more efficient ( or efficient at all) against "real, active, reactive, thinking" players. In other words, trained players tend to focus playstyle that ensure higher survival rates, partly because they play "less games", prefering to focus on the few they have.

      It does win against noob exactly like the "farming strategies" (albeit maybe not as quick), but it gives a fighting chance for the 1 over 40 where you encounter good players. It also gives a fighting chance against massive gold users, and is the basis of why there exists, in the alliances, a "competition" that looks like "big game hunting" :D

      Back to the UAV thingy : I can only agree that UAV first works, but imagine that you are playing against yourself. Wouldn't you immediatly strike and make yourself blind, considering how you would think "damn, this guy is careless" ?
      You would have 0 reasons to not take this overwhelming advantage over the opponent ^^.
      Running an online alliance is pretty much like running a small company, except you need to find other way than money to keep your employees productive. May they play or work, they are humans.

    • Kalrakh wrote:

      Zemunelo wrote:

      Nahh, in public you really don't need radars or UAV's at all.
      Just always take more land away from the city. Let the enemy come to youṛ territory. You'll see everything he has. He will be slow. If he tries to take it with single unit just bomb it with arty or strike fighters/helicopters.
      You can check his buildings and CON news and you'll not be surprised.

      Other than that use scouts on mountains or ASF if enemy has coastal cities and he is transporting by the sea.
      Either way you'll see exact composition of his troops.
      Some cities are close to borders, ideal to check enemy composition and lvl.
      Lvl is even more important because you can see where is he going with research.

      And always use alfa strike as tactics. Attack first if you can. Unprovoked surprise, why not. If he is strong enemy near you, maybe already in full coalition... Just deal with him before others can come to help him.
      They will probably ask you to join after that :rolleyes:
      .
      But don't expose what you have.
      Eg. If you have canons or strike fighters as alfa damage dealers, don't use them to finish AI because it will be in news. Hide what you have as much as possible.

      The key is to react before conflict occurs. Eg. If you se a lot of airports some higher lvl, just rush combined AA. If you see a lot of baracks, some high lvl and in news armor divisions, build anti armor units.

      Why would you need radars or UAV's in public?
      • What now? Let them come to you or strike them first? You do not seem so sure yourself.


      Radar help me keeping everything under control. With a radar I exactly know which provinces are free and up for grabs and which are needed to get cleared out first.
      Without a radar I could run everywhere into a possible fight and risk unnecessary losses.
      A radar also tells me, where he has his aircrafts patroling so maybe I can make a sneak take down with my SAMs.

      Not sure how you even want to alpha strike if you do not know exact positions of hostile troops. :whistling:
      Also if you mean specs with scouts it is pretty much the same as a UAV, just the ground version, so you are using 'UAV' yourself.

      Well both of course :D why would you only wait? This part is just general strategy. And I explained how to gather intel.
      You can use UAV if you wish, but you can't use radar to see everything.

      With radar you actually don't know is there only one single unit or whole stack.
      You can guess but you can't be sure.

      Your only-radar strategy is working only with arty and "shoot everything on sight" or you are use it any other way?

      Btw nobody mentioned UAV as a AA bait strategy.

    • some interesting replies here, seems like i have stirred the pot when it comes to my love with UAVs


      yes you are right, at the start of the game they are pretty useless, and radar would be better,
      BUT
      Radar is only useful on your boarders, it cant see out to sea, it cant do advance recon on an area of land you need to dock with first.



      you could say i do love UAVs because i normally get them to Lvl 6 fairly quick and at that point yes they are stealthed and SAMs are not an issue. BTW, im yet to go up against a player that has deployed SAMs


      in general i use a mixture of radar and SAMS, and as an example, on the only game im playing at the moment i have radar deployed all over the coast and SAMs at various choke points also, however my UAVs are still playing a more important role than the Radar.
      It is the rule in war if you are ten times the enemy's strength - SURROUND THEM
      If five times - ATTACK THEM
      If double, be able to - DIVIDE THEM
      If equal - ENGAGE THEM
      If fewer be able to - EVADE THEM
      If weaker be able to - AVOID THEM

    • UAV as a bait strategy, o yes ive done that as well, had my planes patrolling nearby to draw out their planes.
      It is the rule in war if you are ten times the enemy's strength - SURROUND THEM
      If five times - ATTACK THEM
      If double, be able to - DIVIDE THEM
      If equal - ENGAGE THEM
      If fewer be able to - EVADE THEM
      If weaker be able to - AVOID THEM

    • strangeworld57 wrote:

      UAV as a bait strategy, o yes ive done that as well, had my planes patrolling nearby to draw out their planes.
      That's the only real cool thing with UAV, Non stealth UAV paired with 4 stealth ASF, hooks 'em every time.
      *** The Creator of Zombie Farming ***
      The KING of CoN News!!!
      The "Get off my lawn!" cranky CoN Forums Poster - not affiliated with Dorado in any way


      "Death comes to us all. Shall I deal you in?" - DoD

    • Stealth UAV are incredibly useful, no arguing with that. In fact, nobody is arguing that UAVs are very useful. It's more about a shade of gray :D

      UAV before or after Radar, this kind of thing :D
      Running an online alliance is pretty much like running a small company, except you need to find other way than money to keep your employees productive. May they play or work, they are humans.

    • Not only that, you can trigger AA response if you sacrifice UAV but you're then "free" to attack with all your planes in 10 minutes.
      I am not sure if they changed anything about this, but before a year+ it was easy to accomplish.
      Basically your planes are hit with half of potential AA damage because in that 10 mins time period AA only defend on direct attack.
      You can then hit hard with multiple stacks. Obviously you can use patrol circles to avoid traveling.

    • Opulon wrote:

      ...
      But in fact, it's entirely what happens. One good spectacular example would be the typical "My army is 90% Strike fighters/heavy bombers", that you see often in flashpoint or 4X.


      This guy DEVASTATES 90% of players with a 3 K/D, easy peasy. And then, he falls against someone that is active and uses properly SAM/ASF synergy. The Guy then IS devastated with a 7 K/D easy peasy. I remember very precisely one of those occurrences where a man was playing JAPAN and didn't bother with a navy, he made 80 strike fighters, dominated all of asia, until he lost everything in 30 minutes against an ally and me because we had OF COURSE put frigates around his homeland city. he tried to fly all his strike fighters at once into the frigates, and lose everything in a matter of a few AA rounds.

      ...


      Back to the UAV thingy : I can only agree that UAV first works, but imagine that you are playing against yourself. Wouldn't you immediately strike and make yourself blind, considering how you would think "damn, this guy is careless" ?
      You would have 0 reasons to not take this overwhelming advantage over the opponent ^^.
      Yes - It looks like we are violently agreeing.

      90% Strike Fighters! Maybe that was me? :D No, not really.

      80 Strike Fighters! How long was that game? In my vast! experience, the most SF I've ever built before the mop-up phase began was about 30 (along with building a few tanks and recons, a handful of ships, some infantry, and a few ASF too). 30 is enough to send 6 five-packs out to obliterate modest enemy stacks. If that Japan position had time to build 80 SF, it had time to either take over the world, or lose to you sooner =O , long before reaching 80 SF.

      About the UAV thingy - I think I still like building a couple of UAVs, and a few ASF during the first 10 turns in public games, and using them to be my eyes and ears (I micromanage them). Occasionally a UAV gets shot down - Usually because I do something stupid. That loss hurts me, but doesn't blind me, except for just a little while, in one location, in each of two separate games (so far).

      The odds of having a really good player next door, and of having to fight them instead of allying with them, have been so low that if I always prepared for that situation in every game, the necessary investments would offend the part of my brain that wants to (more quickly) maximize the return on every investment I make. So far, I wouldn't feel like the insurance policy was worth the cost. So I invest in anti-NPC and anti-Rookie units instead. If they aren't next door, I learn about them in the news reports, before I encounter them.

      Again, yes, we are agreeing, and are simply choosing to optimize for different possibilities.

    • Zemunelo wrote:



      Well both of course :D why would you only wait? This part is just general strategy. And I explained how to gather intel.
      You can use UAV if you wish, but you can't use radar to see everything.

      With radar you actually don't know is there only one single unit or whole stack.
      You can guess but you can't be sure.

      Your only-radar strategy is working only with arty and "shoot everything on sight" or you are use it any other way?

      Btw nobody mentioned UAV as a AA bait strategy.

      Radars tell you WHERE something is,UAV/Specs tell you WHAT there is. Or you just send some choppers to 'test' is out, if they are in patrol range of your borders :)

      Who sad anything about a 'only-radar' strategy anyway? Knowing how you combine your troops it the most critical aspect in CON if you want to ever leave the skill level range of 'public elite'

      Choppers do not need AA-bait, AA-bait got anyway quite a lot less effective when the gave AA a reload of 10 min instead of 1 hour.

    • The first infantry unit 1st right of bat, only 1 min to research, and they are needed for taking territories. I like to get them 1st and build 1 at every city, so they are like my second line ready by day 2.
      Then I like to have the first armor car unit, then I go for tank destroyers, then I try to pick up SAM sites for pesky planes. I also try to get Artillery units the 1st and 3rd, because after upgrading the first you can air assault them to keep up with your troop movement. While stacks of 10 5inf/5tankdestroyers move across the field and take cities, dropping off 1/1 of the stack at each city until its at 36% but I like to keep the large stack moving.
      After a few weeks I'll have researched a few ships, but not upgraded fully, and planes of all types to help scout troops ahead of my stack movement.

    • Kalrakh wrote:

      WW3 are only quickly finished these days, because 80% of player base drop dead before even one week has passed.

      On a map with 64 active players it could take months, even more if there a 3-4 coalition in a cold war situation, waiting for a good opportunity to strike.
      K - Thanks for the info - I understand, and I assume that Mr_Mp5 is playing now - So that's why I'm asking about his current expectations.

      PS: I wish that more (any) current WW3 games resembled what you describe. See Worst Game Feature . The current dropout levels suck way too much fun out of the public games.

      I have to wonder if Dorado's stats show that they attracting (and retaining for more than one or two games) more (paying) players now than they were attracting and retaining before the recent(ish) flood of User####### accounts began.

      KFG

      The post was edited 1 time, last by KFGauss ().

    • williamdice wrote:

      OK, so I know this is a situation dependent question and depends on your country's location and production capabilities and what your allies are doing but do you have a preferred order of priorities for researching? Early game do you stick to the same thing every game?

      e.g. I read somewhere that AA guns should be picked up as soon as possible, officers can wait until mid game and tank destroyers are more important than tanks but don't know if that is good advice. Likewise I read to never research National Guard. Is that true and/or are there any research tracks that you would always avoid/never bother with?

      (This may have been answered in other threads but I couldn't find them - please redirect me if they do)
      01.) Mot Infantry
      02.) ASF
      03.) MAA
      04.) Destro
      05.) Mot Infantry L2
      06.) Navy Commander
      07.) SAM
      08.) Land Radar
      09.) MRL
      10.) TDS

      I might change 3. 4. and 6. according to the situation but this is the basic for me for the pub game.
      Have fun, nothing personal.