The best airforce?

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    • The best airforce?

      I have been wondering how to create a superior airforce while still being able to have the ability to wipe out invading forces. The path I have been taking, which to me seems the cheapest yet still efficient, is to build ASF's and Heli gunships. These both only require a level 1 airbase and are fairly cheap to produce. The only problem I have is destroying hard targets. the helis, at high tiers levels can take out hard targets in a couple runs and soft targets in one run, but still is it worth it? Also there are the ASF's, I prefer ASF over SF because I, again, prefer defense over attack. The Heli stacks and ASF stacks seems to work really well, I have won two games using this strategy.
      Is there Something Else better? Should I be doing something Else?




      "The Greatest Battles are never fought with Men, but words" -Me
      "The greatest battles are never won by men but with words"-Me

      "Free flies and no work"-ME

      "Duty is heavier than a mountain death as light as a feather" Lan from the Wheel of Time

    • If your goal is winning games quickly, when you win, then the units you build (among other considerations) should reflect that goal.

      If your goal is winning the greatest percentage of the games you join, the units you build should reflect that different goal.

      If your goal is always being ready if you encounter a sophisticated opponent, the units you build should reflect that different goal.

      If your goal is being a Coalition member specializing in Air units, that yet another goal (and is affected by overall coalition's goal(s)).

      The existance of these different goals makes getting good advice (fewer conflicting recommendations) hard if you don't supply a little more information in your question.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by KFGauss ().

    • Well everyone needs an airforce at the beginning of the game, an airforce is a key part of victory in any conflict. My question simply is whether, when applied to any use(the ones you listed above), my strategy with airforce is a good one.




      "The Greatest Battles are never fought with Men, but words" -Me
      "The greatest battles are never won by men but with words"-Me

      "Free flies and no work"-ME

      "Duty is heavier than a mountain death as light as a feather" Lan from the Wheel of Time

    • I tried a ASF / gunship air force before.
      I used a helicopter officer with the gunships.
      Not bad, but range of the helicopters was an issue and the ASFs don't pack a punch at their larger range.

      In the current game I am playing, I am using both the helicopter ace & the fixed wing ace with gunships and strikers this go around. However, in this game there are no reports of any players using fighters or much air force at all. In general I am more satisfied with this mix.

      My thinking is this: The fixed wing ace, the one ASF and the four strikers I currently have can handle any air to air combat. The gunships with an officer and the strikers with an officer pack a punch to ground targets. When the SF & gunship ground attack air units get damaged enough and sent to a hospital to heal I can combine the two officers to continue their mop up efforts because of their greater HPs and damage.

      If you use the air officers with a stack and patrol an area, the officer stack will attack everything inside the patrol bubble.

      @Buckeyechamp uses naval ASF instead of normal ASF for his air to air engagements and also as damage absorbers when ground attacking. If you do not plan on raising the level of your ASF via research, the naval ASF is a good option. You need a level two airbase, but if you go for the naval ASF it has better air to air damage compared to the ASF researched up one level. In my current game if I need more ASFs, the naval ASF will be considered as an option.

      Edit:

      In my current game I am playing with a European doctrine where SFs get a HP bonus.
      Both @KFGausss & @TheShinwackers avatars have almost the same facial expression.

      The post was edited 4 times, last by Im On Smoko ().

    • CMS_Flash wrote:

      I struggle to understand a lot of people's prioritization of SFs over ASFs. If you go SFs and your opponent goes ASFs, don't you automatically die?

      Yes, ASFs are vulnerable to SAMs, but so are SFs.

      And yes, ASFs don't effectively kill ground, but don't you always need to secure the air superiority before thinking about how to utilize it?
      Most public game opponents don't build ASFs, even when the CoN News is full of stories about SFs devastating ground troops - Don't ask me why.

      For that reason you can win plenty of public games without building as many ASFs (aka zero or nearly zero) as common sense would otherwise tell you to build.
    • Pretty much any air force can and will be countered. If you're looking to win all of your games, go for MRL stack ;)

      Anyways, on the air force:
      In a pub game, ASF + gunship heli/sf/eaa + awac is probably sufficient for a quick win. remember to get nasf for damage distrib
      "All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy. That's how far the world is from where I am. Just one bad day." - The Joker
    • rwt wrote:

      Pretty much any air force can and will be countered. If you're looking to win all of your games, go for MRL stack ;)

      Anyways, on the air force:
      In a pub game, ASF + gunship heli/sf/eaa + awac is probably sufficient for a quick win. remember to get nasf for damage distrib
      Nah - I have to disagree.

      "MRL stack" is over-simplified advice. It's over-simplified to the point of being poor advice.

      Separately, a 6-plane types mix is rarely needed in public games. That's overly complicated advice, especially when the the six types include AWACS and snail-slow helis. You will almost always do fine (and win a bit sooner) with fewer air-power complications.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by KFGauss ().

    • KFGauss wrote:

      rwt wrote:

      Pretty much any air force can and will be countered. If you're looking to win all of your games, go for MRL stack ;)

      Anyways, on the air force:
      In a pub game, ASF + gunship heli/sf/eaa + awac is probably sufficient for a quick win. remember to get nasf for damage distrib
      Nah - I have to disagree.
      "MRL stack" is over-simplified advice. It's over-simplified to the point of being poor advice.

      Separately, a 6-plane types mix is rarely needed in public games. That's overly complicated advice, especially when the the six types include AWACS and snail-slow helis. You will almost always do fine (and win a bit sooner) with fewer air-power complications.
      "a 6-plane types mix is rarely needed in public games". i agree. there's a reason I used a slash and not a "+" when referring to gunship heli/sf/eaa. choosing one of the three is sufficient. the nasf is optional.

      on the MRL stack--would you have liked it if I had said exactly which units? if so, here we go:
      1 mob radar + 5 MRL + 4 SAM + 5asf/nasf overhead. MRL/SAM ratio could be switched around (6-3, for example)


      Zozo001 wrote:

      rwt wrote:

      ASF + gunship heli/sf/eaa + awac is probably sufficient for a quick win.
      A "quick" win mean getting there before AWACS becomes a thing. Besides, if you have EAA then you need nothing else other than ASF.
      I get AWACs by day 20 or so, which is generally when the land grabbing or big fight begins. Of course, if it is land grab time, then AWACs is purely optional, it just helps a bit in land grab. in a fight with competent opponents, AWAC is necessary.
      "All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy. That's how far the world is from where I am. Just one bad day." - The Joker
    • rwt wrote:

      KFGauss wrote:

      Separately, a 6-plane types mix is rarely needed in public games. That's overly complicated advice, especially when the the six types include AWACS and snail-slow helis. You will almost always do fine (and win a bit sooner) with fewer air-power complications.
      "a 6-plane types mix is rarely needed in public games". i agree. there's a reason I used a slash and not a "+" when referring to gunship heli/sf/eaa. choosing one of the three is sufficient. the nasf is optional.
      That original notation (to me) is an odd way to express what you meant, but I understand now - Thanks.
      I still disagree a bit, but not enough for a drawn out debate.

      The post was edited 2 times, last by KFGauss ().

    • rwt wrote:

      KFGauss wrote:

      Nah - I have to disagree."MRL stack" is over-simplified advice. It's over-simplified to the point of being poor advice.
      on the MRL stack--would you have liked it if I had said exactly which units? if so, here we go:

      1 mob radar + 5 MRL + 4 SAM + 5asf/nasf overhead. MRL/SAM ratio could be switched around (6-3, for example)
      I don't think we should pay attention to what I like as much as we should pay attention to clarity.

      My response is that public games, against typical public-game opponents,
      • I would absolutely loath sending that 15-unit, MRLS + ASF stack out and then watching it slowly crawl across the map, and
      • While a solo public-game player is likely to win using it, I don't think investing the necessary research time, research resources, mobilization time, and mobilization resources into building each stack (or partial stack) guarantees a public-game win.
      • YMMV

      The post was edited 1 time, last by KFGauss ().

    • KFGauss wrote:

      rwt wrote:

      KFGauss wrote:

      Nah - I have to disagree."MRL stack" is over-simplified advice. It's over-simplified to the point of being poor advice.
      on the MRL stack--would you have liked it if I had said exactly which units? if so, here we go:
      1 mob radar + 5 MRL + 4 SAM + 5asf/nasf overhead. MRL/SAM ratio could be switched around (6-3, for example)
      I don't think we should pay attention to what I like as much as we should pay attention to clarity.
      My response is that public games, against typical public-game opponents,
      • I would absolutely loath sending that 15-unit, MRLS + ASF stack out and then watching it slowly crawl across the map, and
      • While a solo public-game player is likely to win using it, I don't think investing the necessary research time, research resources, mobilization time, and mobilization resources into building each stack (or partial stack) guarantees a public-game win.
      • YMMV

      To each their own opinion I guess.
      "All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy. That's how far the world is from where I am. Just one bad day." - The Joker