Destroyers need their Air Arm

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    • Bacon230 wrote:

      Well not many attack helicopters use destroyers to my knowledge. ASW for sure,then maybe Gunship at later levels.
      Yea not many attack helis do, but I do think that gunships should be able to operate from the deck
      The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants
      - Thomas Jefferson

      Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
      - Milton Friedman

      Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster.
      - Sun Tzu
    • Oceanhawk wrote:

      Brutaful wrote:

      I don't know if it would be to overpowered or not or if it's even possible with carriers (I'm pretty new), but I think it would be pretty cool if the airborne or marines could utilize the destroyers and/or carriers for some sort of transport or "waypoint". For example, an airborne unit can fly to a destroyer, land and maybe refuel there, before flying to their actual destination. This would allow for airborne to have more range which might be OP, but I think it would be a nice addition, although I'm not aware of how realistic this idea would be.

      Anyway, I do recall there being a suggestion about having helicopter dedicated carriers and I can only assume they would utilize some sort of function like the one I stated above. If anyone can share info on whether this kind of idea will be implemented or not, that would be very much appreciated.
      Make another thread,:P
      But I think that LHDs will solve that. Hopefully they may have some support ability when they come out
      Yeah I might need to do that since I have some other ideas I might wanna add. Hopefully the LHDs do solve this, I like the airborne, but I believe they should be slightly more versatile and this would still allow for them to be decently balance because it's not like there's an increase in overall movement speed, just how far they can fly.
    • Eternus wrote:

      lol you can't be serious about adding for destroyers ability to host one or even more helicopters - whatever type it would be. It's simply hilarious in terms of balance. In practice player would have cheap, 1/2 seats heli carrier. It's absurd. They are not used like that in reality. Only for very, very limited ASW - in game it would be represented above it level of capabilities and would break the balance of naval warfare as much as land warfare (if destroyers would be able to host land attack helos).
      I want destroyers to have (at the beginning) capability for one ASW heli (and only ASW), and upgrade it up to two with one of the upgrades.


      #GoForThe18th
    • Brutaful wrote:

      Oceanhawk wrote:

      Brutaful wrote:

      I don't know if it would be to overpowered or not or if it's even possible with carriers (I'm pretty new), but I think it would be pretty cool if the airborne or marines could utilize the destroyers and/or carriers for some sort of transport or "waypoint". For example, an airborne unit can fly to a destroyer, land and maybe refuel there, before flying to their actual destination. This would allow for airborne to have more range which might be OP, but I think it would be a nice addition, although I'm not aware of how realistic this idea would be.

      Anyway, I do recall there being a suggestion about having helicopter dedicated carriers and I can only assume they would utilize some sort of function like the one I stated above. If anyone can share info on whether this kind of idea will be implemented or not, that would be very much appreciated.
      Make another thread,:PBut I think that LHDs will solve that. Hopefully they may have some support ability when they come out
      Yeah I might need to do that since I have some other ideas I might wanna add. Hopefully the LHDs do solve this, I like the airborne, but I believe they should be slightly more versatile and this would still allow for them to be decently balance because it's not like there's an increase in overall movement speed, just how far they can fly.
      Yes, I think they are fine now distance wise, but maybe a slight increase. And if we could recall them when airborne would be great. I wouldnt mind if we could control then when they are airborne, but would seriously want to be able to at least cancel them.
      The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants
      - Thomas Jefferson

      Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
      - Milton Friedman

      Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster.
      - Sun Tzu
    • Pablo22510 wrote:

      Eternus wrote:

      lol you can't be serious about adding for destroyers ability to host one or even more helicopters - whatever type it would be. It's simply hilarious in terms of balance. In practice player would have cheap, 1/2 seats heli carrier. It's absurd. They are not used like that in reality. Only for very, very limited ASW - in game it would be represented above it level of capabilities and would break the balance of naval warfare as much as land warfare (if destroyers would be able to host land attack helos).
      I want destroyers to have (at the beginning) capability for one ASW heli (and only ASW), and upgrade it up to two with one of the upgrades.
      I wouldnt mind them being able to take a heli gunship later on in the tech tree. But only ASW Id be fine with
      The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants
      - Thomas Jefferson

      Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
      - Milton Friedman

      Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster.
      - Sun Tzu
    • Oceanhawk wrote:

      Pablo22510 wrote:

      Eternus wrote:

      lol you can't be serious about adding for destroyers ability to host one or even more helicopters - whatever type it would be. It's simply hilarious in terms of balance. In practice player would have cheap, 1/2 seats heli carrier. It's absurd. They are not used like that in reality. Only for very, very limited ASW - in game it would be represented above it level of capabilities and would break the balance of naval warfare as much as land warfare (if destroyers would be able to host land attack helos).
      I want destroyers to have (at the beginning) capability for one ASW heli (and only ASW), and upgrade it up to two with one of the upgrades.
      I wouldnt mind them being able to take a heli gunship later on in the tech tree. But only ASW Id be fine with
      Heli gunships would be too OP.


      #GoForThe18th
    • Pablo22510 wrote:

      Oceanhawk wrote:

      Pablo22510 wrote:

      Eternus wrote:

      lol you can't be serious about adding for destroyers ability to host one or even more helicopters - whatever type it would be. It's simply hilarious in terms of balance. In practice player would have cheap, 1/2 seats heli carrier. It's absurd. They are not used like that in reality. Only for very, very limited ASW - in game it would be represented above it level of capabilities and would break the balance of naval warfare as much as land warfare (if destroyers would be able to host land attack helos).
      I want destroyers to have (at the beginning) capability for one ASW heli (and only ASW), and upgrade it up to two with one of the upgrades.
      I wouldnt mind them being able to take a heli gunship later on in the tech tree. But only ASW Id be fine with
      Heli gunships would be too OP.
      well gunships or attack helis.. tbh they either both or neither can..
      The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants
      - Thomas Jefferson

      Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
      - Milton Friedman

      Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster.
      - Sun Tzu
    • Fair enough, I dont mind not having other helis on board TBH.
      The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants
      - Thomas Jefferson

      Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
      - Milton Friedman

      Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster.
      - Sun Tzu
    • Oceanhawk wrote:

      Well Im pushing for ASW helis, but I dont see why not have Attack and gunships

      I think helis need an extra little edge, and IRL their versatility is a factor when picking an attack heli over a ground attack aircraft.
      I told you why above. Other helis? Again, bc it would break he balance and is highly unrealistic.
      People just need to understand how helos work here. They don't. It's not fault of the game for people to be lazy b...

      Pablo22510 wrote:

      I want destroyers to have (at the beginning) capability for one ASW heli (and only ASW), and upgrade it up to two with one of the upgrades.

      1 ASW could be eventually ok, but 2? It would break balance further. The best option in case of having ASW on destroyers would be special class of ASW - with shorter range and worst stats. Even better LHDs - that class should be in game (instead of some OP destroyers with helis).
      Any other than ASW helis on destroyers would break balance at higher degree, any other air units or airmobile on destroyers would be simply absurd and OP them.
    • Eternus wrote:

      Oceanhawk wrote:

      Well Im pushing for ASW helis, but I dont see why not have Attack and gunships

      I think helis need an extra little edge, and IRL their versatility is a factor when picking an attack heli over a ground attack aircraft.
      I told you why above. Other helis? Again, bc it would break he balance and is highly unrealistic.People just need to understand how helos work here. They don't. It's not fault of the game for people to be lazy b...

      Pablo22510 wrote:

      I want destroyers to have (at the beginning) capability for one ASW heli (and only ASW), and upgrade it up to two with one of the upgrades.
      1 ASW could be eventually ok, but 2? It would break balance further. The best option in case of having ASW on destroyers would be special class of ASW - with shorter range and worst stats. Even better LHDs - that class should be in game (instead of some OP destroyers with helis).
      Any other than ASW helis on destroyers would break balance at higher degree, any other air units or airmobile on destroyers would be simply absurd and OP them.
      Nah after some more thoughts. Helis just not being used properly your right. ASW helis on destroyers is fine and a must. But only 1 heli, not two.
      The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants
      - Thomas Jefferson

      Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
      - Milton Friedman

      Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster.
      - Sun Tzu
    • Just my two cents, as I love using naval units, just for the sake of using them. I would really like to see a Littoral carrier. Rather than a big expensive ship, a carrier you can develop cheaply and early, that only carries helicopters. Something like the iwo jima class. These can be similar to corvettes in that they operate best in coastal areas, and maybe have them able to transport a marine unit or two as well. Or maybe instead an air assault unit. I think this would add an exciting dynamic with the more limited range heli units being more effective as it would not use space on a regular carrier or require the regular carrier to go into coastal zones.
      ----------------------

      Jacopo: Why not just kill them? I'll do it! I'll run up to Paris - bam, bam, bam, bam. I'm back before week's end. We spend the treasure. How is this a bad plan?

      Remember that no one ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb idiot die for his country.
    • Oceanhawk wrote:

      Eternus wrote:

      . Even better LHDs - that class should be in game (instead of some OP destroyers with helis).Any other than ASW helis on destroyers would break balance at higher degree, any other air units or airmobile on destroyers would be simply absurd and OP them.
      Nah after some more thoughts. Helis just not being used properly your right. ASW helis on destroyers is fine and a must. But only 1 heli, not two.
      My only issue with the LHD, is it is often carrying harrier or f-35. I don't think this new unit should be able to carry fixed wing aircraft, just as a point of balance and uniqueness. The Garibaldi class carrier in RL is already a harrier carrying carrier. I think a cheap to research, unit that can carry two air assault units and maybe 5 helicopters would be an awesome addition.
      ----------------------

      Jacopo: Why not just kill them? I'll do it! I'll run up to Paris - bam, bam, bam, bam. I'm back before week's end. We spend the treasure. How is this a bad plan?

      Remember that no one ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb idiot die for his country.
    • War-spite wrote:

      Oceanhawk wrote:

      Eternus wrote:

      . Even better LHDs - that class should be in game (instead of some OP destroyers with helis).Any other than ASW helis on destroyers would break balance at higher degree, any other air units or airmobile on destroyers would be simply absurd and OP them.
      Nah after some more thoughts. Helis just not being used properly your right. ASW helis on destroyers is fine and a must. But only 1 heli, not two.
      My only issue with the LHD, is it is often carrying harrier or f-35. I don't think this new unit should be able to carry fixed wing aircraft, just as a point of balance and uniqueness. The Garibaldi class carrier in RL is already a harrier carrying carrier. I think a cheap to research, unit that can carry two air assault units and maybe 5 helicopters would be an awesome addition.
      Yea I agree, no fixed wing aircraft from the LHDs...

      4-6-8 Heli carring

      And 3-4-6 I would have thought for air assualt units. More than that
      The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants
      - Thomas Jefferson

      Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
      - Milton Friedman

      Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster.
      - Sun Tzu
    • Oceanhawk wrote:

      War-spite wrote:

      Oceanhawk wrote:

      Eternus wrote:

      . Even better LHDs - that class should be in game (instead of some OP destroyers with helis).Any other than ASW helis on destroyers would break balance at higher degree, any other air units or airmobile on destroyers would be simply absurd and OP them.
      Nah after some more thoughts. Helis just not being used properly your right. ASW helis on destroyers is fine and a must. But only 1 heli, not two.
      My only issue with the LHD, is it is often carrying harrier or f-35. I don't think this new unit should be able to carry fixed wing aircraft, just as a point of balance and uniqueness. The Garibaldi class carrier in RL is already a harrier carrying carrier. I think a cheap to research, unit that can carry two air assault units and maybe 5 helicopters would be an awesome addition.
      Yea I agree, no fixed wing aircraft from the LHDs...
      4-6-8 Heli carring

      And 3-4-6 I would have thought for air assualt units. More than that
      Yeah I hadn't thought about the advancement path. I was thinking initially. I didn't want them to be overpowered as a low development cost unit. My biggest challenge with cv's is they take so much of your research resources that you really need to be committed to getting them, at the detriment of other areas, I would like the LHD to be available without a massive sacrifice of your other research, and hence why I limited them. But I agree late game having 6 air assault units with 8 heli would be a kickass unit.
      ----------------------

      Jacopo: Why not just kill them? I'll do it! I'll run up to Paris - bam, bam, bam, bam. I'm back before week's end. We spend the treasure. How is this a bad plan?

      Remember that no one ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb idiot die for his country.
    • War-spite wrote:

      Oceanhawk wrote:

      War-spite wrote:

      Oceanhawk wrote:

      Eternus wrote:

      . Even better LHDs - that class should be in game (instead of some OP destroyers with helis).Any other than ASW helis on destroyers would break balance at higher degree, any other air units or airmobile on destroyers would be simply absurd and OP them.
      Nah after some more thoughts. Helis just not being used properly your right. ASW helis on destroyers is fine and a must. But only 1 heli, not two.
      My only issue with the LHD, is it is often carrying harrier or f-35. I don't think this new unit should be able to carry fixed wing aircraft, just as a point of balance and uniqueness. The Garibaldi class carrier in RL is already a harrier carrying carrier. I think a cheap to research, unit that can carry two air assault units and maybe 5 helicopters would be an awesome addition.
      Yea I agree, no fixed wing aircraft from the LHDs...4-6-8 Heli carring

      And 3-4-6 I would have thought for air assualt units. More than that
      Yeah I hadn't thought about the advancement path. I was thinking initially. I didn't want them to be overpowered as a low development cost unit. My biggest challenge with cv's is they take so much of your research resources that you really need to be committed to getting them, at the detriment of other areas, I would like the LHD to be available without a massive sacrifice of your other research, and hence why I limited them. But I agree late game having 6 air assault units with 8 heli would be a kickass unit.
      well put, really hope the devs work on this. Its really needed :P
      The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants
      - Thomas Jefferson

      Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
      - Milton Friedman

      Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster.
      - Sun Tzu
    • Oceanhawk wrote:

      War-spite wrote:

      Oceanhawk wrote:

      War-spite wrote:

      Oceanhawk wrote:

      Eternus wrote:

      . Even better LHDs - that class should be in game (instead of some OP destroyers with helis).Any other than ASW helis on destroyers would break balance at higher degree, any other air units or airmobile on destroyers would be simply absurd and OP them.
      Nah after some more thoughts. Helis just not being used properly your right. ASW helis on destroyers is fine and a must. But only 1 heli, not two.
      My only issue with the LHD, is it is often carrying harrier or f-35. I don't think this new unit should be able to carry fixed wing aircraft, just as a point of balance and uniqueness. The Garibaldi class carrier in RL is already a harrier carrying carrier. I think a cheap to research, unit that can carry two air assault units and maybe 5 helicopters would be an awesome addition.
      Yea I agree, no fixed wing aircraft from the LHDs...4-6-8 Heli carring
      And 3-4-6 I would have thought for air assualt units. More than that
      Yeah I hadn't thought about the advancement path. I was thinking initially. I didn't want them to be overpowered as a low development cost unit. My biggest challenge with cv's is they take so much of your research resources that you really need to be committed to getting them, at the detriment of other areas, I would like the LHD to be available without a massive sacrifice of your other research, and hence why I limited them. But I agree late game having 6 air assault units with 8 heli would be a kickass unit.
      well put, really hope the devs work on this. Its really needed :P
      I've been thinking on this every issues. Your LHD idea is spot on with what I was working up in my head. This would definitely be a great addition to the game.

      On the destroyer issue, while I do agree about the ASW choppers, I have to say there is precedent for gunship/attack chopper off a destroyer. Task Force 160 operated off of them as far back as the early/mid '90's I believe. I worked with some former members when I was stationed at Ft. Campbell back then.