Unit engagement

    This site uses cookies. By continuing to browse this site, you are agreeing to our Cookie Policy.

    • Unit engagement

      I'm not sure if this is intentional or not, but when an aircraft engages another aircraft above ground units it seems to fight the ground units as well, even though you told the aircraft to attack the aircraft only. Then the ground units absorb the damage and you end up losing the fight. Has this been done intentionally in an update? If so that's really frustrating because I thought that is only supposed to happen with patrol mode. This is with air superiority fighters.

    • The ground unit wasn't AA. The point I'm making is if a ground unit has no offensive air attack then why does an Air Superiority fighter engage it when I've only asked it to engage the aircraft. That doesn't make sense. I could understand if it's in Patrol mode, but it's not. Also, I've never seen this happen before so I'm assuming it was an update.

    • THADE1 wrote:

      when an aircraft engages another aircraft above ground units it seems to fight the ground units as well, even though you told the aircraft to attack the aircraft only. Then the ground units absorb the damage ... I thought that is only supposed to happen with patrol mode. This is with air superiority fighters.
      ok,
      You seem to expect different behavior from "attack" and "patrol" commands, from what I can/have observed the only difference I see is the "target location".

      It's not clear from your description if you're referring to a single target stack, or multiple stacks. It would be hard to give any answer without more details.

    • Hakville wrote:

      THADE1 wrote:

      when an aircraft engages another aircraft above ground units it seems to fight the ground units as well, even though you told the aircraft to attack the aircraft only. Then the ground units absorb the damage ... I thought that is only supposed to happen with patrol mode. This is with air superiority fighters.
      ok,You seem to expect different behavior from "attack" and "patrol" commands, from what I can/have observed the only difference I see is the "target location".

      It's not clear from your description if you're referring to a single target stack, or multiple stacks. It would be hard to give any answer without more details.
      Oh dont worry, there plenty of difference between using patrol and attack
      I am The Baseline for opinions

    • Teburu wrote:

      Hakville wrote:

      THADE1 wrote:

      when an aircraft engages another aircraft above ground units it seems to fight the ground units as well, ..
      ok,You seem to expect different behavior from "attack" and "patrol" commands, from what I can/have observed the only difference I see is the "target location".
      ...
      Oh dont worry, there plenty of difference between using patrol and attack
      maybe I mis-spoke a bit, I've used the attack command very rarely but I have used it to chase units (naval and aero) which I'm not sure is realistic.

      I see noobs attacking provinces all the time, this should expose their visibility to neighbors or something. Generally I also do use it to achieve max range for artillery bombardment, but it's not a command I use very often.

      Specifically in this context, I wouldn't expect aircraft behavior to be different if you had an attack or a patrol command in the same exact spot.

      I'd be interested to hear if you're aware of more differences.
      I disagree with the comment about splash damage, I think that's a feature of BM.

      Maybe part of this question (another way to word it) is what is even a valid target for Attack and Patrol commands. And how does the game mechanics determine which unit(s) are engaged.

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Hakville ().

    • Hakville wrote:

      ok,You seem to expect different behavior from "attack" and "patrol" commands, from what I can/have observed the only difference I see is the "target location".

      It's not clear from your description if you're referring to a single target stack, or multiple stacks. It would be hard to give any answer without more details.
      Sorry for late response. Yes, I do expect different behaviour as is the whole purpose of having two command buttons. Attacking a single unit stack is the point of the attack button, so why has it started engaging ground units that are below it.

    • THADE1 wrote:

      I do expect different behaviour as is the whole purpose of having two command buttons. Attacking a single unit stack is the point of the attack button, so why has it started engaging ground units that are below it.
      this is a good discussion,
      it gets at some low level game dynamics.

      If a ground unit is moving, sometimes it will not engage a nearby enemy (maybe until it's path intersect).
      However if you click stop you'll see it "engage".

      Your unit never really attacks, the attack command is a movement that will follow an enemy unit. If you catch up to him then the unit will "engage". The attack command will stop a naval or artillery unit at the max "engagement" distance.

      My experience with aircraft is that they will only engage one unit (maybe the closest idk), if that unit dies then it will engage any other unit in range. So you can strike (engage) multiple valid targets, I'm not assuming the asf or npa work any different from standard strike (except as noted under Fixed Wing)

      The terminology is a bit confusing because they recycled the term "attack range" for a different purpose on aircraft.

    • Hakville wrote:

      THADE1 wrote:

      I do expect different behaviour as is the whole purpose of having two command buttons. Attacking a single unit stack is the point of the attack button, so why has it started engaging ground units that are below it.
      this is a good discussion,it gets at some low level game dynamics.

      If a ground unit is moving, sometimes it will not engage a nearby enemy (maybe until it's path intersect).
      However if you click stop you'll see it "engage".

      Your unit never really attacks, the attack command is a movement that will follow an enemy unit. If you catch up to him then the unit will "engage". The attack command will stop a naval or artillery unit at the max "engagement" distance.

      My experience with aircraft is that they will only engage one unit (maybe the closest idk), if that unit dies then it will engage any other unit in range. So you can strike (engage) multiple valid targets, I'm not assuming the asf or npa work any different from standard strike (except as noted under Fixed Wing)

      The terminology is a bit confusing because they recycled the term "attack range" for a different purpose on aircraft.
      Thats not how airattack works at all

      direct attack:
      Attacks target until:
      - the enemy is killed, after that it will just sit at the home airbase
      - the aircraft itself dies
      - the enemy leaves the aircrafts attack range, then the aircraft also will sit at the airbase

      patrol:
      - engages all units inside the patrol radius at full strength
      - keeps patrolling the targeted area until directly ordered otherwise


      At no point do aircraft automatically take off and engage enemies on its own
      I am The Baseline for opinions

    • Teburu wrote:

      Hakville wrote:

      THADE1 wrote:

      I do expect different behaviour as is the whole purpose of having two command buttons. Attacking a single unit stack is the point of the attack button, so why has it started engaging ground units that are below it.
      this is a good discussion,it gets at some low level game dynamics.
      If a ground unit is moving, sometimes it will not engage a nearby enemy (maybe until it's path intersect).
      However if you click stop you'll see it "engage".

      Your unit never really attacks, the attack command is a movement that will follow an enemy unit. If you catch up to him then the unit will "engage". The attack command will stop a naval or artillery unit at the max "engagement" distance.

      My experience with aircraft is that they will only engage one unit (maybe the closest idk), if that unit dies then it will engage any other unit in range. So you can strike (engage) multiple valid targets, I'm not assuming the asf or npa work any different from standard strike (except as noted under Fixed Wing)

      The terminology is a bit confusing because they recycled the term "attack range" for a different purpose on aircraft.
      Thats not how airattack works at all
      direct attack:
      Attacks target until:
      - the enemy is killed, after that it will just sit at the home airbase
      - the aircraft itself dies
      - the enemy leaves the aircrafts attack range, then the aircraft also will sit at the airbase

      patrol:
      - engages all units inside the patrol radius at full strength
      - keeps patrolling the targeted area until directly ordered otherwise


      At no point do aircraft automatically take off and engage enemies on its own
      That's wrong. In patrol, planes still have to return back to their set airbase after a certain amount of time.

    • Mother Hen wrote:

      Teburu wrote:

      Hakville wrote:

      THADE1 wrote:

      I do expect different behaviour as is the whole purpose of having two command buttons. Attacking a single unit stack is the point of the attack button, so why has it started engaging ground units that are below it.
      this is a good discussion,it gets at some low level game dynamics.If a ground unit is moving, sometimes it will not engage a nearby enemy (maybe until it's path intersect).
      However if you click stop you'll see it "engage".

      Your unit never really attacks, the attack command is a movement that will follow an enemy unit. If you catch up to him then the unit will "engage". The attack command will stop a naval or artillery unit at the max "engagement" distance.

      My experience with aircraft is that they will only engage one unit (maybe the closest idk), if that unit dies then it will engage any other unit in range. So you can strike (engage) multiple valid targets, I'm not assuming the asf or npa work any different from standard strike (except as noted under Fixed Wing)

      The terminology is a bit confusing because they recycled the term "attack range" for a different purpose on aircraft.
      Thats not how airattack works at alldirect attack:
      Attacks target until:
      - the enemy is killed, after that it will just sit at the home airbase
      - the aircraft itself dies
      - the enemy leaves the aircrafts attack range, then the aircraft also will sit at the airbase

      patrol:
      - engages all units inside the patrol radius at full strength
      - keeps patrolling the targeted area until directly ordered otherwise


      At no point do aircraft automatically take off and engage enemies on its own
      That's wrong. In patrol, planes still have to return back to their set airbase after a certain amount of time.
      And then they fly back and resume patrol; they dont stay idle at the airbase
      I am The Baseline for opinions

    • ok,

      What happens AFTER an engagement is interesting, but this has nothing to do with the original question.

      Teburu didn't read the quote well before responding.
      It would be nice if u guys didn't quote so much text that you're not really responding to. When we Quote-Reply we can trim it down to what's relevant.

      I just had a situation where i used Patrol to try to hit an enemy, and the edge of the patrol-area just barely caught a completely different idle enemy. Even though my patrol was positioned significantly closer to the intended target, he wasn't even hit.

      I'm assuming the engagement of an attack-command works the same as a patrol-command, except it's positioned perfectly over the target.

      Now, it's possible that there is a difference (I'm talking about the engagement, nothing before or after)...

      If we really wanted to test every scenario, let me distinguish two different attacks-commands (on the same location).

      * There's a ground unit moving towards the center of a province, the unit will arrive before your AsfStrike:
      1st, you attack the province center
      2nd, you attack the unit label


      The computer needs to calculate a lot of things, it needs to check if any other units are patroling in range etc. It's possible but i doubt they wrote different code for the two buttons, therefore I'm pretty confident they work the same.

    • Hakville wrote:

      ok,

      What happens AFTER an engagement is interesting, but this has nothing to do with the original question.

      Teburu didn't read the quote well before responding.
      It would be nice if u guys didn't quote so much text that you're not really responding to. When we Quote-Reply we can trim it down to what's relevant.

      I just had a situation where i used Patrol to try to hit an enemy, and the edge of the patrol-area just barely caught a completely different idle enemy. Even though my patrol was positioned significantly closer to the intended target, he wasn't even hit.

      I'm assuming the engagement of an attack-command works the same as a patrol-command, except it's positioned perfectly over the target.

      Now, it's possible that there is a difference (I'm talking about the engagement, nothing before or after)...

      If we really wanted to test every scenario, let me distinguish two different attacks-commands (on the same location).

      * There's a ground unit moving towards the center of a province, the unit will arrive before your AsfStrike:
      1st, you attack the province center
      2nd, you attack the unit label


      The computer needs to calculate a lot of things, it needs to check if any other units are patroling in range etc. It's possible but i doubt they wrote different code for the two buttons, therefore I'm pretty confident they work the same.
      Patrol hits all units in the radius; if that didn’t work out for you then you either misplaced it by a bit or are just using mobile.

      Direct attack hits only the targeted unit; if another unit is close enough to the targeted one than it might get hit by splash dmg
      but that has already been elaborated on above


      attack and patrol work differently and even at times interact completely different with other mechanics.
      I am The Baseline for opinions

    • THADE1 wrote:

      I'm not sure if this is intentional or not, but when an aircraft engages another aircraft above ground units it seems to fight the ground units as well, even though you told the aircraft to attack the aircraft only. Then the ground units absorb the damage and you end up losing the fight. Has this been done intentionally in an update? If so that's really frustrating because I thought that is only supposed to happen with patrol mode. This is with air superiority fighters.
      Does asf even engage ground units unless explicitly told so?