HELICOPTER UPDATE 170706

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  • HELICOPTER UPDATE 170706


    Dear Players,
    This week introduces the new Helicopter Gunship and Attack Helicopter models for Western Doctrine, as well as and update for Tier 3 European Gunship in European Doctrine. All the other models are also receiving a cosmetic update

    NEW MODELS
    WESTERN HELICOPTER GUNSHIP PROGRESSION
    • AH-6M Little Bird
    • MD 500 Defender
    • UH-1Y Venom
    WESTERN ATTACK HELICOPTER PROGRESSION
    • AH-1G Cobra
    • AH-1Z Viper
    • Apache Longbow
    EUROPEAN HELICOPTER GUNSHIP TIER 3 REPLACEMENT
    • NH-90
    // Your CON Crew

    The post was edited 1 time, last by Gorczyk ().

  • What do you mean huh? Look at the picture and then look below at the description of both trees and tell me what is missing? Do you see the Longbow anywhere? This is some lame old argument about gunships vs attack when in reality they are technically the same and those first two for gunship were never used widespread as gunships. The little bird is used as an extraction and insertion for SpecOps. The S-97 may be its replacement.

    Fantasy has to do with what is actually being used in those roles vs what gets depicted here.
    Ain't Nothing But A Thing!

    The post was edited 1 time, last by DevinMacGregor ().

  • If the Longbow Tier 3 in the western doctrin, it is better to Change the european attack helicopter Tier 2 (also Longbow). It makes no sense to have the same helicopter in different tiers.

    My Suggestion for european attack helicopters:
    Tier 1: BO 105 or Lynx, Tier 2 Mangusta, Tier 3: Tiger
    „Morgen, ihr Luschen!“ --- „Morgen, Chef!“ (Ausbilder Schmidt alias Holger Müller bei der Arbeit)
  • To make clear what I mean by fantasy is that this tree was somehow felt it needed to be changed with the only thing that needed to be changed if anything was the first gunship be a UH-1 "hog" leaving the SuperCobra and Viper right where they were. The first Attk be an AH-1G and just move both apaches up removing the S-97. But hey some people want to keep clicking on pixels to see pictures of their favorite military craft I guess.

    This was somehow a fuss that needed to be changed YET I can research for an AH-1G on day one the same day I can research for B-47. Even though the B-47 was retired before the first AH-1Gs made it to Vietnam. The B-52 bomber I have to wait to research even though it first saw service in 1955 a good decade before again the first AH-1Gs saw service in Vietnam. As well as I can research the B-2 stealth bomber long before I can research the B-1 bomber even though the B-1 saw service before the B-2 did. There is no F-117 option but instead the F-35. F-117 had only 60 some built but it was a stealth strike fighter and it did see service. It was retired due to the F-22 which there is less than 200 but that is due to the F-35 which the USAF decided to switch to ending the production of the Raptors.

    We can move on to tanks. T-14. Sure this is in the modern slot but how many does Russia actually have? It's high price is cost prohibitive and they more than likely will not be able to have very many of them. I am not denying it has cool features.

    warhistoryonline.com/featured/russias-new-tank-fleet.html

    The T90s which are still relatively new Russia does not have many of and has been in production for years now but apparently is a huge export to India.

    army-technology.com/projects/t90/

    But does cool features determine what goes into what timeline slot? None of those features we can actually use in the game. And in game graphics you can barely see anything so how many of you are zooming in? Here are three of my T-14 tank divisions sitting in Portugal.

    Lisbon.jpg
    Ooooooo

    As well to make it clear. I love this game. I see so much in it and I am not unappreciative of the undertaking by the developers etc.
    Ain't Nothing But A Thing!
  • Yep there is a hog. Take off the pods and they called them slicks. As I was saying in another thread the AH-1G was the first Cobra. It was originally given an UH designator, UH-1H. A stands for attack and the U stands for utility. Utility are primarily troops transports but can serve different roles. Put guns on it and it is attack mode, ie gunship. It can as well move cargo such as ferring arty. AH-1G was the first purely in gunship mode. For the Gulf War the US Army was still using some of them and they knocked out a lot of tanks.

    Well not your favorite any more since someone felt a SpecFor helo should have that first slot. UH-1s are fun to ride in btw especially at treetop. Feels like a roller coaster ride. They are loud as #@$# . You can hear them long before you see them compared to a Blackhawk or Apache both of which you see before you hear it, especially the apache.

    Looking at my Indonesian tree which is European I see these two things.
    seriously.png

    seriously2.png

    LOL. I mean really. I was unaware that the F-117 was sold to EU nations? As well as the SR-71 which is a recon plane was sold to the EU as a stealth bomber? No wonder they have money troubles. The damn thing leaks fuel like a sieve till it gets to cruising speed, ie it heats up then seals. It is a damn rocket ship. Where do the bombs go?

    iliketowastemytime.com/facts-y…know-about-sr71-blackbird

    I was under the impression that Western meant US and what the US uses and exports. European means EU and what the EU (member nations guys, come on) uses and exports. Eastern means Russian and is what Russia uses and exports.

    It is what it is I guess. Not to mention now the Western gunship timeline is off. The AH-6 was designed from the MD 500 so how could one come before the other? This is what the little bird was developed from. Read the section on SpecFor. I mean this is not battlefield or GTA is it?

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hughes_OH-6_Cayuse
    Ain't Nothing But A Thing!

    The post was edited 1 time, last by DevinMacGregor ().

  • Lovely update, glad my suggestions made it all the way. Skins look lethal. And a lovely touch up on the airborne infantry :)
    The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants
    - Thomas Jefferson

    Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
    - Milton Friedman

    Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster.
    - Sun Tzu
  • What do you mean? I am showing an MD 500 Defender in the tier two tech tree. The pic I provided is another gunship besides the AH-6 that is used by the Special Operations of the US Army. AH-6 is a modified OH-6 by putting guns on it and later modeled on the MD 500. It is a light attack helo and the MH-6 is its sister craft that insert and extract SpecFor and SpecOps teams, ie delta force. Both are called little birds because they are tiny as f$$k and you can cram them into a C-130. These are light helos and SpecOps needed light helos for its missions. See below the flying egg.

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MD_Helicopters_MH-6_Little_Bird
    And this is the larger issue; The AH-6 did not fly till 2004. Well at least this variant. The MH-6 has been around since the 80s.
    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_AH-6

    The above pic is a MH-60 Blackhawk. It is another variant that the SpecOps runs. It cannot carry any troops because its bay is full of ammo. There are numerous pics of it. I just grabbed one. Saw one with 16 hellfires.

    So what timelines are these? Is Tier 1 50s/60s, Tier 2 70s/80s and Tier 3 90s/00s because that would make the B-47 fit for Tier 1 but not the T-14 for Tier 3. Regardless the MH-6 which there are only a several dozen of was not until the 80s.

    Is this Tier 1 60s/70s, Tier 2 80s/90s, and Tier 3 00s/10s? If so then B-47 should be out and the T-14 can fit. The MH-6 still does not fit in Tier 1 though as again it was not introduced till the 80s.

    The reality is is that some doctrines are going to be behind others because they are in real life. Some are working on 5th generation while others are working on 6th generation and by having only 3 tiers that limits the selections. Which is why I said these tiers are more fantasy and what fanboys want of particular craft and vehicles other than what was actually used in the norm during those time lines.

    Again this is a prime example since the AH-6 did not fly till 2004 and not only being modeled after the OH-6 Cayuse was as well later modeled after the MD 500, ie its blades etc. So this is getting the cart before the horse.

    And what was wrong with the old graphics for this? I am not getting the yellow and ring around the blades.
    blades.png
    Ain't Nothing But A Thing!
  • Does anyone else think the Ah-1z Viper looks like Blue Thunder?
    ----------------------

    Jacopo: Why not just kill them? I'll do it! I'll run up to Paris - bam, bam, bam, bam. I'm back before week's end. We spend the treasure. How is this a bad plan?

    Remember that no one ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb idiot die for his country.
  • It is complicate.
    For me is tier 1 after the 2. WW to 1980s, tier 2 1980-2010 and tier 3: 2010 - now/future. But it is to dificult to bring every research in this timeline.

    Tier 1 must be a unit that exist in the end of the cold war.
    Tier 2 must be a unit in the time of 9.11 (Afganistan war, gulf war 2003)
    Tier 3 must be an up to date unit or a unit that will be researched in the next years

    For the feeling of this game it will be very nice to have a Bell UH 1 hog as gunship level 1. this helicopter is the typical helicopter of the western world. If we get the airmobile infantry in 3 different tiers
    the Bell UH 1 must be the western helicopter.
    „Morgen, ihr Luschen!“ --- „Morgen, Chef!“ (Ausbilder Schmidt alias Holger Müller bei der Arbeit)

    The post was edited 3 times, last by Seele07 ().

  • DevinMacGregor wrote:

    LOL, yeah I thought so. No comment really.

    Here is another 160th gunship besides the light attack helo AH-6.

    americanspecialops.com/photos/night-stalkers/mh-60l-dap.php



    Yeah, sure if we have the Venom Gunship, could have this as well. But the defender is fine. These gunships carry machine guns and rocket pods for dealing with soft targets. Unlike attack helis which will carry larger guns as well as helfire and other anti armor missiles
    The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants
    - Thomas Jefferson

    Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
    - Milton Friedman

    Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster.
    - Sun Tzu
  • Seele07 wrote:

    It is complicate.
    For me is tier 1 after the 2. WW to 1980s, tier 2 1980-2010 and tier 3: 2010 - now/future. But it is to dificult to bring every research in this timeline.

    Tier 1 must be a unit that exist in the end of the cold war.
    Tier 2 must be a unit in the time of 9.11 (Afganistan war, gulf war 2003)
    Tier 3 must be an up to date unit or a unit that will be researched in the next years

    For the feeling of this game it will be very nice to have a Bell UH 1 hog as gunship level 1. this helicopter is the typical helicopter of the western world. If we get the airmobile infantry in 3 different tiers
    the Bell UH 1 must be the western helicopter.
    You are aware that what is in game is not the UH-1 It is the UH-1Y Venom. Its a new helicopter and is in service with the USMC.

    Two engines, 4 blades. And a much more powerful chopper.
    Not to be confused with what it was developed from, the UH-1N, and the Vietnam choppers


    This is a new heli, and a much better one.
    The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants
    - Thomas Jefferson

    Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
    - Milton Friedman

    Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster.
    - Sun Tzu
  • Seele07 wrote:

    tier 3 with the venom is ok. But tier 1 must be the hog. Then we have Vietnam feeling
    Nah the little bird is fine, carries a few guns and rocket pods it is fine.
    The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants
    - Thomas Jefferson

    Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
    - Milton Friedman

    Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster.
    - Sun Tzu