About season subs and the stealth officer

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    • About season subs and the stealth officer

      As the title suggest some feedback/suggestions regarding the season subs and the stealth navy officer

      About the subs:
      - its kinda odd that you dont need regular subs to research elite subs, other seasonal units required their "normal" counterparts
      - the increase in building requirements from T2 to T3 seems a bit extrem, especially when you consider that they reach the peak of their power at T2 (lvl 3 harbor + secret lab lvl 1 --> lvl 5 harbor + lvl 2 secret lab)
      - imo they're a bit too early available/ too easy to get to t2

      What do i suggest?
      - make the research of normal subs mandatory for researching them (would make sense, especially in the context that its also a requirement for the other elite units)
      - higher building requirements for T2 than currently (maybe instead of lvl 3 harbor + lvl 1 secret lab --> lvl 3 harbor+ lvl 2 secret lab or something similiar)
      - lower the requirements for T3 subs compared to the T2 requirements ( maybe only lvl 4 harbor instead of lvl 5?)

      About the officer:
      - update tooltips, cuz rn there is appearently no unit that can detect a stealted surface vessel, but i know that at least elite subs can do that so other units probably can too (maybe every unit that can detect subs withing sightrange?)
      --> him being only revealed in sightrange makes him hella difficult to find; even more so on high seas

      What do i suggest?
      - give us tooltips that actually tell us which units can see the naval officer in stealth
      - increase sight range of NPA (maybe even ASW) to make finding him a bit easier (25 is incredibly low, maybe to like 40?)
      I am the basline for opinions
    • You are right Lvl2+ has no sonar signature anymore...

      In that case the question will be. Will units fire back if I engage and retreat? So if I do a hit and run...How fast does the enemy fire back? Does the engine retailiate automatically or only if i keep fire till the next hour?
      Alle sagten: Das geht nicht. Dann kam einer, der wusste das nicht und hat es einfach gemacht.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by kurtvonstein ().

    • Buckeyechamp wrote:

      I do the hit and run even with non stealth and its doesnt seem exact... some auto fire asap .. sometimes like 1 - 1.5 min before fires but typically if can have finger on the move button to reverse as soon as fires get away with it
      Well and thats exacty whats wrong with the game...the hit and run...its gives active players an unfair advantage...
      Alle sagten: Das geht nicht. Dann kam einer, der wusste das nicht und hat es einfach gemacht.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by kurtvonstein ().

    • kurtvonstein wrote:

      Buckeyechamp wrote:

      I do the hit and run even with non stealth and its doesnt seem exact... some auto fire asap .. sometimes like 1 - 1.5 min before fires but typically if can have finger on the move button to reverse as soon as fires get away with it
      Well and thats exacty whats wrong with the game...the hit and run...its gives active players and unfair advantage...
      Which... is very realistic.
    • kurtvonstein wrote:

      effectivly not...in normal life every ship has more then 1 commaning officer that can react to emerging treats.

      In the game you have 1 officer...if he is offline the ship suffers complete damage without retailiation....
      well reaction time usually isnt instant but delayed by a bit; hit and run is actually an irl military strategy :D


      de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoot-and-scoot

      removing that would make ranged battles just as stale as „normal“ melee


      maybe next time place your ships somewhere safe when you’re offline :)
      I am the basline for opinions

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Teburu ().

    • Teburu wrote:

      kurtvonstein wrote:

      effectivly not...in normal life every ship has more then 1 commaning officer that can react to emerging treats.

      In the game you have 1 officer...if he is offline the ship suffers complete damage without retailiation....
      well reaction time usually isnt instant but delayed by a bit; hit and run is actually an irl military strategy :D

      de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoot-and-scoot

      removing that would make ranged battles just as stale as „normal“ melee


      maybe next time place your ships somewhere safe when you’re offline :)
      agree thats why I like Naval warfare. also get a lot of people even when active treat ships like inf and think they have to run their ships into yours. I try my best never to get locked into an sea engagement. Finally after I sunk like 6 of this guys ships I had to tell him .. you realize that ship fires at 75 miles right...lol. people may think you are afraid and running away ..... Im just moving till my guns reload that hit them again in 1 hr while they follow me. or if you have opponents with deep / shallow penalties take them into "deep" or shallow water which ever gives best advantage. But these nuances escape most. Since Ships take long to heal my main goal is to minimize damage to me even if it takes more patience to destroy enemy. another example I had a train of 3 or 4 single corvettes following my 1 Frigg and could have taken me down by I maneuvered about and picked them apart. then finally had 2 charging at me ... so I charged at them to meet them in deep water (cutting their HP in half); shot over the top of 1st to destroy the 2nd first and let the 1st run into me (that allowed basically) 2 firing sequences vs 1. To me Naval warfare allows for the most use of tactics over brute force. Planes a different type of strategy as forced to return to a fixed base before next move... Navy is free range (within the realm of the lanes on map).
    • You have to distinguish. The are 2 cases:

      1. The player with the bigger guns kill and runs away to reload - no objection from me. You are better skilled and did some research / strategy to put yourself into this advantage

      2. The player is enjoying a "glimpse" in the system when attacks a unit with the same range and moves out of range before the enemy units reacts...i have problem with this. Because its not a disadvantge in the gamebecause i made the wrong decision and didnt upgrade my units. its because i had to go offline and got smacked in the meantime(that why i dont play 4x speed)
      Alle sagten: Das geht nicht. Dann kam einer, der wusste das nicht und hat es einfach gemacht.
    • thats... why you park units in safe spots when you're afk :D doesnt even need to be ships
      hell i wont send my helis out to patrol somewhere risky when im not online

      and btw: if fire would be returned immediatly, season subs would become utterly useless

      in the end its just a game mechanic like pointdefense etc; and imo it makes things a lot less stale
      I am the basline for opinions

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Teburu ().

    • i never let my helicopters patrol when not online...and thats not the point of using a glimpse in the gamemechanic
      and btw ships are not really ever safe...you cant really hide them...

      My problem is that you can go in and out of shooting range of a unit and do a hit and run...

      its is basically the same like feeding AA with drohnes and then attacking with whole airforce....

      luckily feeding artillery stacks withminor units and then attacking is not possible anymore as onyl the killing units spend therishot...same must apply for AA gun...
      Alle sagten: Das geht nicht. Dann kam einer, der wusste das nicht und hat es einfach gemacht.
    • Teburu wrote:

      kurtvonstein wrote:

      effectivly not...in normal life every ship has more then 1 commaning officer that can react to emerging treats.

      In the game you have 1 officer...if he is offline the ship suffers complete damage without retailiation....
      well reaction time usually isnt instant but delayed by a bit; hit and run is actually an irl military strategy :D

      de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoot-and-scoot

      removing that would make ranged battles just as stale as „normal“ melee


      maybe next time place your ships somewhere safe when you’re offline :)
      Yep. This is what I was saying, reaction times are never instant, and usually do take about a minute or so at least to even arrange a counter-battery fire mission, let alone for the shells to reach their target, BDAs to be done, etc. Even with multiple rotating commanding officers, you can’t expect them to react like computers.
    • well usually sight range is much much greater than shooting range so reaction times is not usually this problem unless subs.
      Yeah this AA tic thing is pretty annoying should allow some units to shoot while others don't for instance 3 aa stack drone passes by only 1aa fires this might be ahrd to implement as they say the old layer of ancient code. but much more realistic. Also patrl aa envelope and pretty much every thing should be controlled what to shoot and what to not manually .
    • Stratieon wrote:

      Teburu wrote:

      kurtvonstein wrote:

      effectivly not...in normal life every ship has more then 1 commaning officer that can react to emerging treats.

      In the game you have 1 officer...if he is offline the ship suffers complete damage without retailiation....
      well reaction time usually isnt instant but delayed by a bit; hit and run is actually an irl military strategy :D
      de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoot-and-scoot

      removing that would make ranged battles just as stale as „normal“ melee


      maybe next time place your ships somewhere safe when you’re offline :)
      Yep. This is what I was saying, reaction times are never instant, and usually do take about a minute or so at least to even arrange a counter-battery fire mission, let alone for the shells to reach their target, BDAs to be done, etc. Even with multiple rotating commanding officers, you can’t expect them to react like computers.
      I doubt that Artillery battles are big hit and runs...unless you mean small units with mortars. Anyway. The active player has a big advantage...
      Alle sagten: Das geht nicht. Dann kam einer, der wusste das nicht und hat es einfach gemacht.