Upgrade army

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    • the advantage is that players who play SIM City and build up their economy first will not have that high upgrade costs at the moment they start mobilizations. (unless the upgrade costs is the same like the new units cots - old units cost)

      Its a basic feature that comes with nearly all strategy games that you upgrade old units when you get a better technology researched. But hey maybe you dont want to upgrad to keep the unit upkeep low...

      And everyone who enjoys conquering Antartica for the fun of it...or Brazil and USA for the VP should be more then happy to have one more reason to click around.

      I might even suggest to mark multiply units at once to do the upgrade...depending on your current savings.

      BTW: I dont understand Germanicos Answer. Yes it is planned to add it to CON but they dont ...WHAT?
      @Dorado If you Close the Forum and move everything to Discord you will lose my Feedback for sure.

    • kurtvonstein wrote:

      the advantage is that players who play SIM City and build up their economy first will not have that high upgrade costs at the moment they start mobilizations. (unless the upgrade costs is the same like the new units cots - old units cost)

      Its a basic feature that comes with nearly all strategy games that you upgrade old units when you get a better technology researched. But hey maybe you dont want to upgrad to keep the unit upkeep low...

      And everyone who enjoys conquering Antartica for the fun of it...or Brazil and USA for the VP should be more then happy to have one more reason to click around.

      I might even suggest to mark multiply units at once to do the upgrade...depending on your current savings.

      BTW: I dont understand Germanicos Answer. Yes it is planned to add it to CON but they dont ...WHAT?

      I believe, Germanico wanted to say:

      Yes, we know, they added it, but we will not.



      Every new unit produced would be automatically a upgraded unit, so if you constantly produce you would end up with up to 7 upgrade levels of the same unit, which might be as confusing as as exploitative.

      Just adding it to give bored players more to do is a bad reason to do something, it is like adding swords into Zelda which break after 5 hits...

      Also it would just make the already resources even more scarce, if you would suddenly have to pay for upgrades.

      And yes, I know this feature from games like Civilzations and Hearts of Iron, they are quite integral parts there. Though it also works quite automatically in Hearts of Iron for example.


      Edit: In neither of those games upgrades are something you would have to do on a daily regular bases, like it would have to be done in this game.

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Kalrakh ().

    • If you have new lvl of the same unit it should not lvl up automatically esspecially on foreign territorry in the middle of the fight.
      So lvl up button with small payment in difference between previous and present lvl cost is just fine. With little time needed to finish the job. But to lvl up only on your territory to avoid magical lvl up in the middle of the fight or when marching through an enemy land.
      Planes must be grounded, ships near cost/city within some distance or nearest sea zone and ground units located in any of your provinces.
      It should be a part of the strategy and planing as this game already is. Sometimes you need to change your plans and sometimes the reason can be to lvl up your units.
      I don't see the reason not to do it.
      A button to upgrade all units can solve the micromanagement problem.

    • Imgagine haven 100+ troops, having to level ups per day and having to mark every troop, spread all over the world, just to be able to utilise 'upgrade all'

      Even worse if use the Civilisation method of needing troops in specific territory to be even able to do it.

      One troop under way and max all will not be available, now unselect all those troops, you are out of position and have fun...

      Most level changes are rather insignifant and hardly worth the additional level up effort.

      In Civilisation it works, because level ups have A) signifikant effect and B) they are scarce because getting them researched takes a lot of effort.

    • Basically this is one of the most controversial topics in games. What is "realistic" and what is "fun"?
      Having worked on and played many strategy games I am very well accustomed to upgrading mechanics - and more often than not find myself loathing them.

      Why is that you ask? Well here is an example from CIV 1-6: You start exploring your world with a warrior early in the stone age and by the time your glorious nation has reached the modern age they are still somewhere half a world away, swinging their clubs while walking through shrubs. You need to bring them home if you want to preserve them and upgrade them - but it isn't worth it. This breaks my suspension of disbelief and also highlights the problem of upgrading: In most games where there is an upgrade system, you will struggle to get your units upgraded accordingly and by the time you have done so a newer tech is already on the horizon or even researched, making you feel helplessly outdated while removing all the positive experience of unlocking the research in the first place. When I started playing COW years ago it was one of the really positive things I noticed early on "hey nice - I get the stuff immediately and can exploit my advantage". That left a really good feeling in me as a player.

      Now I hear people ask: "but being f2p - why don't you embrace it? Surely people will pay more to stay up to date?" ...and that may be true, but I actually believe it will make the less hardcore/non-paying player rather shy away from upgrading until absolutely necessary. And that isn't in anyone's interest. It may also result in an unwanted drop of monetization in research - both investment-wise and speedup.

      In regards to realism: to do it right we really would have to allow upgrading units only to the next tier, forcing players to establish a "new" force of Tier 2 or Tier 3 units accordingly. While surely feasible technically, the question remains: Is this really fun and what would be the secondary effect of it? Most probably many players would side track into a different branch - especially if this upgrade also is accompanied by increased mobilization requirements such as Higher Level Buildings as a prerequisite.

      I've got it all designed on paper for ages and later discussed the changes they were planning with my colleagues from bytro, but so far I have deliberately not asked the team to work on this due to my fear of crushing the research fun out of all the free players who, let's face it, are the backbone of the game.

      What do you think? And please consider the silent majority in this as well. Looking forward to your feedback...

      //G
      "Going to war without France is like going hunting without an accordion." Gen. Norman Schwarzkopf

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Germanico ().

    • I never really liked upgrading in games where you have to start anew in a different game. In games where once you are done with that stage, all the upgrades roll back, it was ridiculously irritating to keep on researching the same thing. Even worse, you had to upgrade each unit individually, which cost money and was really expensive. This was a huge reason why I bounced around lots of games during the three months before I graduated to Middle School. When I first found this game, I was absolutely delighted that it wasn’t the case here. And in my opinion, this is a big buying point this game has over hundreds of mediocre strategy games, and is part of what makes this game unique and fun to play.
      In short: no, if you implement this I’ll quit within a month

    • I like the idea, but not sure what effect it will have on the game in the long term.

      The game in short term will undeniably be more strategical, you will have to micromanage units and also think that before attacking you might want to send your units to army bases to upgrade or ships to the coastal waters, and calculate how much time an upgrade will require (if not instantaneous) etc. Also it will favour more active players.


      On the other side, some players like 737373elj will not like changes and might go as far as stopping the game.
      Moreover, right now most players leave the game very early, I think the biggest percentage stop playing before they reach rank 25 (elite challenges limit). Complicating the game isn't going to help. The ones that stay are the ones that are active (or so I think), this change will demand more activity to players that are inherently not active to begin with.

      Not gonna enter the monetisation and gold part of the discussion, I think you know that better than us, and you would probably had it implemented if it would have a positive impact on the game.

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Salonika3 ().

    • Salonika3 wrote:

      Moreover, right now most players leave the game very early, I think the biggest percentage stop playing before they reach rank 25 (elite challenges limit).
      The bigest percentage stop playing after first few clicks.
      This is mostly because of bad tutorial where players are in 1x game without any knowledge of the game (instead of 4x in separate personal tutorial map with button to speed up game time just for learning things). Than the ads that say "come play real time strategy game" and they realize that their unit need to travel 2h to nearest province (which is not bad but they don't uderstand). So they have nothing to do anymore in the beginning.
      Also the problem with only-gold games if you are not part of alliance but that's the path devs have chosen.

      Non of that has anything to do with micromanagement.
      Regarding upgrades, you would not need to pull back you troops to core cities, just inside your borders and click the button "upgrade all" and wait some time like 1h. Your units are already most of the time inside your borders. If not, they are in fight. And that is the exact exploit that should not be in game. When you are in fight and units magically upgrade.
      Don't get me wrong, I use it too.
      But it is not in the spirit of the game because you have to work a lot for every aspect of the game. Lot of micro, planing and executing your plans. Online presence not to mention.
      And after all that you guys think one new button would ruin it all?
      Also for premium accounts there can be "automatic unit upgrade if possible".
      One more reason to subscribe.

    • Zemunelo wrote:

      Salonika3 wrote:

      Moreover, right now most players leave the game very early, I think the biggest percentage stop playing before they reach rank 25 (elite challenges limit).
      The bigest percentage stop playing after first few clicks.This is mostly because of bad tutorial where players are in 1x game without any knowledge of the game (instead of 4x in separate personal tutorial map with button to speed up game time just for learning things). Than the ads that say "come play real time strategy game" and they realize that their unit need to travel 2h to nearest province (which is not bad but they don't uderstand). So they have nothing to do anymore in the beginning.
      Also the problem with only-gold games if you are not part of alliance but that's the path devs have chosen.

      Non of that has anything to do with micromanagement.
      Regarding upgrades, you would not need to pull back you troops to core cities, just inside your borders and click the button "upgrade all" and wait some time like 1h. Your units are already most of the time inside your borders. If not, they are in fight. And that is the exact exploit that should not be in game. When you are in fight and units magically upgrade.
      Don't get me wrong, I use it too.
      But it is not in the spirit of the game because you have to work a lot for every aspect of the game. Lot of micro, planing and executing your plans. Online presence not to mention.
      And after all that you guys think one new button would ruin it all?
      Also for premium accounts there can be "automatic unit upgrade if possible".
      One more reason to subscribe.
      No.
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    • 100% do not want that

      The style and game play of the game is great the way it is..

      Also I feel like this is only going to benefit the super-gold freaks who won't mind paying the extra $50 for another advantage, but I think you will lose many SC members and micro-gold users.
      I even feel like it will over complicate things for new players as I can remember the game being confusing enough when I first came here.