Dear Dealer of Death,... (Alternate title: Ask DoD)

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    • Buckeyechamp wrote:

      Kalrakh wrote:

      Buckeyechamp wrote:

      Teburu wrote:

      that is assuming that the missile gets hit by the offensive aa tick; with how fast missiles are thats not really reliable

      about missile dmg: iirc its proportional to unit HP with it being a minimum of 50%
      True that ... only time I got hit with a icbm nuke. I bought gold when it was coming in and built up AA units real fast that I thought would take it down. I had them outside city but overlapping protection of city to also cover nearby city. they all fired after nuke went off... thanks alot guys, it was like a grand finale of fireworks but a few seconds too late ;)
      It seems like they fired to defend the city, but they were not strong enough to take down the nuke completely, so they only lowered the potential damage of the nuke
      No they went off at impact. like the blast triggered them.
      an other proove that AA triggers on attack outside the 10 minute frame
      @Dorado If you Close the Forum and move everything to Discord you will lose my Feedback for sure.
    • Pentabuksus2 wrote:

      Is there a viable strategy where you use only a groundbased (none arty) army as your main offensive force?
      yes its called Naval and air power. Stormin Norman and Collin Powell laid out blue print how to win a war fast and with minimal friendly casualties in first Gulf War.

      1. Establish Air superiority
      2. 30 days of taking out infrastructure and hard targets via Airstrikes and naval bombardment / missiles.
      3. Steam roll an already beaten opponent and take a whole country in 3 days.
      "And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him "

      aka ...The killer formerly known as BuckeyeChamp
    • Buckeyechamp wrote:

      Kalrakh wrote:

      Buckeyechamp wrote:

      Teburu wrote:

      that is assuming that the missile gets hit by the offensive aa tick; with how fast missiles are thats not really reliable

      about missile dmg: iirc its proportional to unit HP with it being a minimum of 50%
      True that ... only time I got hit with a icbm nuke. I bought gold when it was coming in and built up AA units real fast that I thought would take it down. I had them outside city but overlapping protection of city to also cover nearby city. they all fired after nuke went off... thanks alot guys, it was like a grand finale of fireworks but a few seconds too late ;)
      It seems like they fired to defend the city, but they were not strong enough to take down the nuke completely, so they only lowered the potential damage of the nuke
      No they went off at impact. like the blast triggered them.
      That is what I mean: They tried to kill the missile on impact but failed, so it went of anyway, though weakened.


      kurtvonstein wrote:

      Buckeyechamp wrote:

      Kalrakh wrote:

      Buckeyechamp wrote:

      Teburu wrote:

      that is assuming that the missile gets hit by the offensive aa tick; with how fast missiles are thats not really reliable

      about missile dmg: iirc its proportional to unit HP with it being a minimum of 50%
      True that ... only time I got hit with a icbm nuke. I bought gold when it was coming in and built up AA units real fast that I thought would take it down. I had them outside city but overlapping protection of city to also cover nearby city. they all fired after nuke went off... thanks alot guys, it was like a grand finale of fireworks but a few seconds too late ;)
      It seems like they fired to defend the city, but they were not strong enough to take down the nuke completely, so they only lowered the potential damage of the nuke
      No they went off at impact. like the blast triggered them.
      an other proove that AA triggers on attack outside the 10 minute frame
      Prove? AA defending allied units was always a feature, it also the way to bait AA and get them to skip their next AA-check
    • well it shoudl either attack every 10 minutes or defend with active AA when a enemy delivers an attack within AA range.

      that would make the units behaviour predictable.

      But attacing only when a friendly unit get attacked but not when the AA unit itself gets attacked is kind of ...strange.
      @Dorado If you Close the Forum and move everything to Discord you will lose my Feedback for sure.
    • Buckeyechamp wrote:

      Pentabuksus2 wrote:

      Is there a viable strategy where you use only a groundbased (none arty) army as your main offensive force?
      yes its called Naval and air power. Stormin Norman and Collin Powell laid out blue print how to win a war fast and with minimal friendly casualties in first Gulf War.
      1. Establish Air superiority
      2. 30 days of taking out infrastructure and hard targets via Airstrikes and naval bombardment / missiles.
      3. Steam roll an already beaten opponent and take a whole country in 3 days.
      I guess you missed the "only ground troops" part of the question. Answer could be: it just isn't viable, but i'm wondering.
    • You get some good results with the early recon rush which can steamroll the early infantry of most opponents. As soosn as tanks or Airplanes enter the stage you have to rethink your strategy.

      You can work a lot with AAguns and SAMS but you ahve to cover a lot of ground. Especially in late game when you have a big country. Mobility is king. This is where any airforce beats you on the ground.

      Second thing is economy. I always say: War is not dying for your country its making the other guy die for his. So when you have only melee units you suffer high casualties. You need a goof infrasturir to compensate this cuaslties. Means a good hospital infrastructre and enoguh replace units that take over while units are healing/reparing.

      This makes the ground forces withput artillery apporach very difficult.

      I did one game without my beloved helicopters...it was a pain in the ass...I was slow in my expansion and I suffered some casualties i would not have had otherwise.
      @Dorado If you Close the Forum and move everything to Discord you will lose my Feedback for sure.
    • kurtvonstein wrote:

      You get some good results with the early recon rush which can steamroll the early infantry of most opponents. As soosn as tanks or Airplanes enter the stage you have to rethink your strategy.


      . . .
      I'll pile onto this comment - I've had good luck in a couple of recent games doing this - My first unit built in every city was a recon instead of an infantry - It worked well - I especially liked being able to use them to reveal neighboring unit and stack contents - An Infantry+Recon pair can maneuver soooo much more confidently than an infatnry+infantry pair can - That knowledge let me plan with more confidence.

      "Knowledge is good."
      Emil Faber

      PS: If I didn't build them immediately (largely using my country's initial stockpiles of resources) my rational brain probably never would have convinced my lizard brain to build them all later. Do it while you still feel rich. :)

      The post was edited 1 time, last by KFGauss ().

    • kurtvonstein wrote:

      thats the trade of...they are cheap rush units...as soon as the first player has a tank destroyer you can throw them in a bin...
      Stay cool - Don't over-react 8)

      As soon as your Recon spots the opponent's first TD, then you know that your own TD (or whatever) is needed; and what's perhaps more important, you know *where* it's needed. Stack it up with the existing Recon+Infantry so that (in the public-game's early days) your stack always knows what it's facing *before* it engages the opponent in combat.

      In my public games, my Recons (frequently paired up with one province-capturing Infantry unit) have remained useful (for general-purpose recon work and for babysitting low-morale recently-captured cities) until those games ended.

      And - I'll emphasize - This answer is consistent with the original question about ground-based troops strategies - And, what I'm describing is a PUBLIC game tactic that has USUALLY (but not always) been useful for me near Day 1.
    • kurtvonstein wrote:

      I am cool as hell...only thing is when you put all your starting ressoruces into recons you miss out building some real shit...you your TD will be 1-2 dys to late...

      damage dealer...
      So far my few bets (in public games) have paid off, and I've been able to build "real shit" in plenty of time - I'm sure that one day they won't pay off as well. When that happens you can use a big flashing font to write "I told you so!". ;)

      And, "Yes", TDs are definitely good at Destroying Tanks (and other Armor, like Recons), but if memory serves me, they're not so good against Infantry blended with armor. That's one reason I described blending the Recons with Infantry, and (although this was only implied earlier), my next few ground-troop builds in those games were Infantry.

      Whether people put lots of insurance policies in place when they play is a personal decision. To the extent we can call what we're discussing "deciding whether to create an insurance policy", I'm simply choosing not to do that (for now). YMMV

      I'll try to make this my last post on the subject and repeat myself here at the end. If I keeping making this bet (building all Recons in my first round of public game ground troop builds), I expect that someday I'll lose the bet (maybe several somedays), but so far ... Not so much.

      Bottom line ... I think we need to "Ask DoD" - It's his thread

      KFG

      PS: My Stay cool comment might have been misinterpreted (aka poorly worded by me). I was referring to you writing that once a TD appears near you, your recons are essentially worthless. I wasn't referring to the fact that you chose to post an opinion about this.
    • KFGauss wrote:

      So far my few bets (in public games) have
      ...


      Bottom line ... I think we need to "Ask DoD" - It's his thread

      KFG

      PS: My Stay cool ...
      I have been following this back and forth and have waited to comment until now. Mainly because I don't truck much with building much of either TDs or Recons (always depending on the map and tactical situation of the country being played) and I am generally going full bore at first to get my ASF force up and running as quickly as possible.

      However, as an opposition set of examples, on WWZ I am on TDs ASAP, and if I have home cites near borders, I will recon vehicle a bit.
      *** The Creator of Zombie Farming ***
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      The "Get off my lawn!" cranky CoN Forums Poster - not affiliated with Dorado in any way


      "Death comes to us all. Shall I deal you in?" - DoD
    • I've been getting quite into Recons lately. Upgrade them to level 3 and they can air assault! This is really useful for jumping between locations that need anti-insurgent garrisons. But it also allows you to plop them down next to an enemy position to see what they've got, and then whisk them away again before they can do anything about it - a bit like a poor man's UAV. It's great for annoying people.

      Similar thing goes for TDs, actually - once you get them air-assault enabled you can cause havoc. Their damage values vs ground units are higher than the equivalent level of attack helicopter, which makes their initial assault very strong. You can also use them as protection for air-assault artillery/AA combos and go jumping around someone's territory smashing stuff up over a really large area.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by WalterChang ().

    • To me recons most over valued unit. sure it is like a tank day 1; but by day 10 absolutely useless in combat and research really doesnt improve much.

      Think best value for money is Anti Tank. cheap/fast to build (dont use competing supplies which usually low on for research and inf; low city requirements to build). They are fast units will eat recons for lunch; 50 pct attack/defense bonus in cities.
      "And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him "

      aka ...The killer formerly known as BuckeyeChamp
    • Buckeyechamp wrote:

      To me recons most over valued unit. sure it is like a tank day 1; but by day 10 absolutely useless in combat and research really doesnt improve much.

      Think best value for money is Anti Tank. cheap/fast to build (dont use competing supplies which usually low on for research and inf; low city requirements to build). They are fast units will eat recons for lunch; 50 pct attack/defense bonus in cities.
      but by day 10 you wont even be using recons anymore
      at most until like day 5 maybe to demolish inf but after that you already have better stuff built
      iirc you can’t even research tds day 1? let alone start the mobilization of them
      I am The Baseline for opinions