REVEALED! Frigates Meta triangle

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    • REVEALED! Frigates Meta triangle

      Hi, all.
      After numerous research and careful reading, I have found the truth about Frigates.
      Newer players do not know the truth, think it's a waste of time to research something that is worse than a corvette at ship to ship combat.
      Well that may be true(Corv. 8.5 DMG Maxed out, Frig 8.0 Dmg maxed out), they are missing the big picture.
      SAMs are part of the meta triangle(According to Nelva's website. If you don't understand french, maybe just dm Opulon. DO NOT translate it using google translate. It will lead to the national guard is an interesting bad unit thing), just because they are anti fixed wing. SAMs do 0 DMG to ground units/naval/helis.
      All the experienced players on the forum, seem to like Frigates for no apparent reason. Why?
      Because Frigates fill multiple roles. They are basically SAMs that can float, MRLs that move 2-3x faster than normal, and corvettes with extra range and HP.
      This is the Truth that the experienced players do not want to tell you.
      Many new players think, "Heck, if someone uses SF on my Destroyers, welp my destroyers have a lot of HP and some defensive air damage and SF only deal 2 damage anyway, wutever."
      Frigates can defend against missiles. But the main thing is that, you can basically "turn off" an enemy airport at a coastal city.
      Send a task force of level 4 frigs over and literally dock.
      Enemy flying in MRLs? Shot down. Enemy trying to fly troops away from city? shot down.
      Enemy sending jets to kill you? Make sure to record that on video.*Enemy uses worst unit possible, sends ASF to deal 0.5 dmg to Frigate*
      Take something else into consideration.
      A cruiser costs 2x more than a Frigate(resource wise).
      Therefore, if you spam enough Frigs, even larger surface vessels like destroyers and cruisers will not be able to destroy your task force, because they do not outrange you, and resource wise they do not deal more damage.
      There is one ultimate frigate killer... But that's a story for another day.
      Hope you enjoyed reading! Please leave your thoughts in the comments below.
      @Opulon Your meta triangle should be a meta SQUARE!
      "Le patriotisme, c'est aimer son pays. Le nationalisme, c'est détester celui des autres."-Charles De Gaulle, Leader of Free France in World War 2.
      English: "Patriotism is to love your country. Nationalism is hating that of others."
    • I disagree with you, Ewacs, despite the frigate being unarguably a good unit and a useful one.

      I disagree with nearly all single individual line, to the point i'm afraid to try to answer it :D
      Running an online alliance is pretty much like running a small company, except you need to find other way than money to keep your employees productive. May they play or work, they are humans.
    • Opulon wrote:

      I disagree with you, Ewacs, despite the frigate being unarguably a good unit and a useful one.

      I disagree with nearly all single individual line, to the point i'm afraid to try to answer it :D
      Lol, I'm confused, why?
      Cruisers do cost 2x as much as frigs.
      Frigs do have the same range as Cruisers.
      Frigs do have the range of an MRL.
      Frigs do move 2x faster than MRL.
      I may have understated the Frigs ultimate weakness.
      It uses machine guns to try and shoot down helis.
      "Le patriotisme, c'est aimer son pays. Le nationalisme, c'est détester celui des autres."-Charles De Gaulle, Leader of Free France in World War 2.
      English: "Patriotism is to love your country. Nationalism is hating that of others."
    • ewac123 wrote:

      Cruisers do cost 2x as much as frigs.
      *1.5x to 1.8x

      ewac123 wrote:

      Frigs do have the same range as Cruisers.
      *only after day 26

      ewac123 wrote:

      Frigs do have the range of an MRL.
      eeh sort of

      ewac123 wrote:

      Frigs do move 2x faster than MRL.
      pretty much every naval unit moves faster than mrl so what really is the point
      and it still moves slower than a cruiser


      ewac123 wrote:

      I may have understated the Frigs ultimate weakness.
      you simply fail to look at the unit as a whole; not compare them only at max lvl
      I am The Baseline for opinions
    • Let's compare them tier one.
      @Teburu we don't have to disagree on everything.
      "1.8x" rounds up to 2.0, good enough."
      What I wrote about speed was talking about how the unit fills multiple roles.
      "Only after day 26" might me right, but remember, destroyers, which cost much more than frigs, and always accompany cruisers, unlock 100 range at a similar time.
      "Le patriotisme, c'est aimer son pays. Le nationalisme, c'est détester celui des autres."-Charles De Gaulle, Leader of Free France in World War 2.
      English: "Patriotism is to love your country. Nationalism is hating that of others."
    • Teburu wrote:

      >compares frigates to cruisers
      >your comparison sucks
      >"but destroyers..."
      Hmmm... My main thing is that a cruiser's only advantage is early range.
      It's sucks against planes, subs, and pretty much anything other than ships.
      And I WAS doing a lategame comparison.
      Frigs are more efficient.
      To be honest, you won't have 100 range cruisers midgame unless u are really dedicating to navy.
      And pls note that you need destroyers before cruisers... just a lot of resources that could otherwise be spent elsewhere.
      "Le patriotisme, c'est aimer son pays. Le nationalisme, c'est détester celui des autres."-Charles De Gaulle, Leader of Free France in World War 2.
      English: "Patriotism is to love your country. Nationalism is hating that of others."
    • cruiser also has hp, damage, and speed advantage over your suggested new meta frigate build. Frigates are a supporting force and not one that is meant to go brrr and win games. If you are going to build a lot of navy you might as well be the dedicated naval player with either attack subs or cruisers. Yes you need to get destroyers before cruisers but that is like one research... you also need to get corvettes before frigates :D
    • yzjqx wrote:

      cruiser also has hp, damage, and speed advantage over your suggested new meta frigate build. Frigates are a supporting force and not one that is meant to go brrr and win games. If you are going to build a lot of navy you might as well be the dedicated naval player with either attack subs or cruisers. Yes you need to get destroyers before cruisers but that is like one research... you also need to get corvettes before frigates :D
      A corvette takes 30 minutes, a destroyer takes a day.
      30 minutes is I think 48 times faster than 24 hours.
      "Le patriotisme, c'est aimer son pays. Le nationalisme, c'est détester celui des autres."-Charles De Gaulle, Leader of Free France in World War 2.
      English: "Patriotism is to love your country. Nationalism is hating that of others."
    • I agree with your destroyer comment.
      Destroyer is anti ship, anti sub, has a lot of HP.
      Frigate is "moderately anti ship, ok at defending vs sub+SAM launcher".
      If SAM is meta why isn't frigate meta?
      all advantages of SAM plus many more.
      "Le patriotisme, c'est aimer son pays. Le nationalisme, c'est détester celui des autres."-Charles De Gaulle, Leader of Free France in World War 2.
      English: "Patriotism is to love your country. Nationalism is hating that of others."
    • frigates are as much meta as sams are
      that being: they do a great job at supporting other units in their stack and keeping them safe from airborne threats
      tho comparing sams and frigates is a bit lacking cuz naval warfare is in theory a bit more complex than landbased on; simply because there are more variables
      I am The Baseline for opinions
    • Stacks of Frigates are fine, until you meet covette and destoryer stacks.
      Frigates have reduced speeds making them annoying to stack in taskforces, unless with submarines.

      Likewise a few helicopters will annilate your frigates, the same way aircraft do to your destoriers.

      Therefore it comes down to the simple fact, level 2 docks, higher electronic costs and high upkeep means you can spam frigates out faster in greater numbers at an earlier stage in game. Where destoryiers are a few days later, are in limited production due to cost of level 3 docks but more importantly have reduced electronic cost meaning a more constant production for weeks, compared to frigates which his a hard limit around 15. More then that your spending gold, as upkeep and production costs rise and rise with research.

      While they lack damage, you can operate 3 stacks together, and abuse extended range rush. Until late game where your fighting stacks of cruisers. Easier to counter with maxxed ballastic missile submarines to take barrages, but again, your electronic usage is huge, ideally your homecity is electronics and your concentrating on capturing electronic cities.

      Great way to win a game, but comes down to dominating the sea early and stopping players building those big docks. And pushing in from sea to land requires alot of NG, purely a numbers game, protecting them from airstrikes while deeper airfields and homecities should be targeted with ballastic missiles. Ideally before they put up missile defenses otherwise its very costly when you have to push inland.

      Most of this is negated by opting for the more powerful destoriers, as you don't need so many, and you can spend your electronics on other equipment that can push deeper into the enemy.

      So a frigate rush requires luck first and foremost, second requires quick expansion and thirdly requires a very active and aggressive player with alot of patients as you'll be making ALOT of enemies very quickly and you wont be invading their land anytime soon. The entire strategy is pure naval domination where your the biggest deadlist naval power on the planet! And anyone who threatens that title is quickly attacked and every single dock city is reduced to rubble.
    • Look, which Naval stack is best depends on what you are using it for.

      My fav Naval stack is 1 Naval Officer, 2 Destroyers and 2 Frigates, because I want a general all around stack that's primary purpose is to pound cities AND support troop invasion, while being able to handle subs.

      Sure it won't go toe to toe with Cruiser stacks, but that's not it's purpose.
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    • Duinenstruiner wrote:

      I found that stacking frigates with attack submarines is a powerful combi.
      For a landing to succeed you need frigates to provide air cover.
      Subs will keep corvettes and other naval at a distance.
      Throwing in a naval officer always helps.
      to provide air cover you need to get close to the land tho; which kinda fucks over the subs cuz of coastal?
      I am The Baseline for opinions
    • After some experimentation, I have to walkback my comments about frigs belonging in the meta.
      Meta means "best" basically, like ASF is meta, SAM is meta, MRL is meta.
      I now completely understand Monsieur Opulon's frustration.
      Sorry about that, I think, the Frig is a good unit, but not "meta".
      Overall, it's just to vulnerable to destroyers and cruisers.
      I neglected to count it's massive electronics
      Naval is so balanced there is no meta...
      Is that good or bad?
      Maybe the mutant camels will arrive to turn the tables.
      "Le patriotisme, c'est aimer son pays. Le nationalisme, c'est détester celui des autres."-Charles De Gaulle, Leader of Free France in World War 2.
      English: "Patriotism is to love your country. Nationalism is hating that of others."