New Unit: Electronic Warfare Aircraft

    This site uses cookies. By continuing to browse this site, you are agreeing to our Cookie Policy.

    • New Unit: Electronic Warfare Aircraft

      Electronic-Warfare Aircraft
      Specialized Electronic-Warfare Aircraft capable of jamming enemy communications and equipment within a small radius.

      The following attributes refer to the unit at a average level (Tier 2 out of 3)
      Class: Heavy
      Ferry range: 10000
      Radar Signature: HIGH
      Combat Radius: 750 (From 500-1000)
      Carrier-Based Aircraft
      Jammer:
      Unit can jam enemy equipment within range (From 75-125, with 100 at T2)
      —Stats go as follows—
      HP: 6 (From 4-10)
      Damage vs Fixed Wing: 0 (4 at T3)
      Damage vs Rotary: 0 (4 at T3)
      Other damages N/A
      Speed: 10
      Sight Range: 25

      New feature: Jamming
      Jamming occurs within a radius, similar to radar and sonar. All friendly units in the radius will have their radar signatures hidden from enemy units (Radar jamming), and will not be revealed by moving onto enemy territory. This is a very powerful effect, but it comes with a catch. Because the EWA cannot jam it’s own signal, it will have a unique Jammer signal. This signal is similar to radar signals, showing a blip where the EWA is. If an enemy unit equipped with a radar is jammed by your EWA, the jamming signal will be visible to the enemy. The jamming signal will also be visible if your EWA is flying over enemy territory. The signal is only displaying the source of the interference and is not specific enough for anti-air units to target, but can be attacked directly with aircraft.
      There is also another ability: Direct jamming
      Direct jamming occurs within sight range (25). Enemy units (not including aircraft) affected by direct jamming lose sight range (radio jamming) and their radar (radar jamming)

      Applications:
      -Employ EWA across the battlefield to cause chaos for the enemy and attack while they are blinded during a war
      -Employ EWA on enemy border just before a surprise attack to protect your troops as they cross or disembark. Garrison in coastal cities can be directly jammed and lose sight range, making them unable to report disembarking enemies
      -Employ EWA during a naval operation to hide the radar signatures of your ships, using aircraft carriers to keep the EWA close and safe
      -Employ EWA to- muaha- to- hehehehe- *ahem* conceal your units from a MRL by hiding their radar signatures from attached Mobile radars. Direct jamming is risky, but can completely eliminate artillery sight
      -Employ EWA and directly jam an enemy AA defense to allow your units to fly though the envelope. This can be especially useful (and realistic) when used with Spec Ops
      -Employ EWA in conjunction with NPA to surprise attack enemy fleets

      Counters:
      -Radar units like Mobile radar, ASF, Infantry officer and AWACS will immediately expose EWA when affected
      -Low health means EWA will struggle to survive enemy attack, even when guarded by ASF
      -Long range AA like TDS will be able to engage EWA long before they will be jammed
      -Mobile Radar and AWACS will be especially effective in dealing with EWA. These two units will be immune to direct jamming. While they still wouldn’t be able to detect hidden radar signals, they can be paired with other units to combat EWA. For example, if you combine mobile radar with SAMs, the enemy EWA will be destroyed when attempting to perform direct jamming. There is also a new upgrade to mobile radar and AWACS; at the end of their research lines, these 2 units will unlock a Anti-Electronic-Warfare Package that makes their radars function normally even within range of EWA. Other radar units like ASF will still be jammed, but can work together with dedicated radar units to continue their mission
      -Units with Scout ability (Such as UAV and CRV) will not lose sight range even when affected by direct jam
      -EWA will always be visible over enemy territory
      -Jamming only occurs when actually patrolling. When moving between airfields, or to a patrol location the jammer will not be active. Only when the patrol actually begins will the jammer activate.
      This means that a lone EWA flying straight to an enemy SAM will likely be shot down before reaching it. The SAM will have to be triggered by a missile or aircraft before the EWA can move onto it and jam it

      —Respective Doctrine Models—
      |Western|
      Tier 1: EF-10B SkyKnight
      Tier 2: EA-6B Prowler
      Tier 3: EA-18G Growler

      |European|
      Tier 1: F-4G
      Tier 2: Tornado ECR
      Tier 3: EA-18G Growler (European)

      |Eastern|
      Tier 1: Mi-8SMV
      Tier 2: Il-22PP Porubshchik
      Tier 3: J-16D

      Thoughts?
      Files
      Yee Haw

      The post was edited 9 times, last by Colonel Waffles ().

    • WalterChang wrote:

      Would Anti-air units like MAA, SAMs, Frigates (and Fighter aircraft, for that matter) be able to engage the EWA inside their AA envelope (or attack range for fast jets), given that the position of the EWA would be visible even with a jammed radar?
      No. The Jammer Symbol shows where the EWA is at any given time, but Anti-air cannot take advantage of it. You can still send things like ASF to attack it, and if a high level AWACS or MR is in range the SAM will function like normal. SAMs will be reduced to point defense.

      It’s a little odd the way units interact with it but I think it would work. This idea is very flexible, and there are a lot of details that can be added or taken away to balance it
      Yee Haw
    • No, it can only work WITH an MRLS range Buff, and a tweak to this "and enemy units within the radius will lose their sight range" After all, it is SIGHT range, not radio range. You know, guys with binoculars and stuff.
      *** The Creator of Zombie Farming ***
      The KING of CoN News!!!
      The "Get off my lawn!" cranky CoN Forums Poster - not affiliated with Dorado in any way


      "Death comes to us all. Shall I deal you in?" - DoD
    • Dealer of Death wrote:

      No, it can only work WITH an MRLS range Buff, and a tweak to this "and enemy units within the radius will lose their sight range" After all, it is SIGHT range, not radio range. You know, guys with binoculars and stuff.
      You need to think on a broader scale. When jammed, the inf cannot communicate with each other. If a guy with binos see an enemy they can’t use their radio to let the others know. The scout units are an exception. We can assume an infantry unit is fairly spread out
      Yee Haw
    • Colonel Waffles wrote:

      Dealer of Death wrote:

      No, it can only work WITH an MRLS range Buff, and a tweak to this "and enemy units within the radius will lose their sight range" After all, it is SIGHT range, not radio range. You know, guys with binoculars and stuff.
      You need to think on a broader scale. When jammed, the inf cannot communicate with each other. If a guy with binos see an enemy they can’t use their radio to let the others know. The scout units are an exception. We can assume an infantry unit is fairly spread out
      No, you need to think better. sight range means what the people on the ship can see, with their eyes. And even in the case of infantry, they are going to be able to relay that information. Your interpretation is hilarious, like they can see it, but it is invisible, because of radar jamming. Wannabe logic=Bugblatter beast of Traal.
      *** The Creator of Zombie Farming ***
      The KING of CoN News!!!
      The "Get off my lawn!" cranky CoN Forums Poster - not affiliated with Dorado in any way


      "Death comes to us all. Shall I deal you in?" - DoD
    • Dealer of Death wrote:

      No, you need to think better. sight range means what the people on the ship can see, with their eyes. And even in the case of infantry, they are going to be able to relay that information. Your interpretation is hilarious, like they can see it, but it is invisible, because of radar jamming. Wannabe logic=Bugblatter beast of Traal.
      I never implied that the units are invisible as a result of radar jamming. Infantry reliant on radios for communication will have trouble communicating within the unit. A inf unit does not have sight range because of one guy sitting up on a rock in the middle of the formation. There are forward scouts relaying information to the rest of the unit. Another thing is that all of this information is being relayed back to you.

      Regardless, no sight range does seem very strong

      Do you think it would be better if the enemy did not lose sight range, only your units don’t have radar signatures and the enemy territory can be completely jammed? As in, they can’t see your units at all unless they are spotted by units?
      Yee Haw

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Colonel Waffles ().

    • Colonel Waffles wrote:

      Dealer of Death wrote:

      No, you need to think better. sight range means what the people on the ship can see, with their eyes. And even in the case of infantry, they are going to be able to relay that information. Your interpretation is hilarious, like they can see it, but it is invisible, because of radar jamming. Wannabe logic=Bugblatter beast of Traal.
      I never implied that the units are invisible as a result of radar jamming. Infantry reliant on radios for communication will have trouble communicating within the unit. A inf unit does not have sight range because of one guy sitting up on a rock in the missile of the formation. There are forward scouts relaying information to the rest of the unit. Another thing is that all of this information is being relayed back to you.
      Regardless, no sight range does seem very strong

      Do you think it would be better if the enemy did not lose sight range, only your units don’t have radar signatures and the enemy territory can be completely jammed? As in, they can’t see your units at all unless they are spotted by units?
      Regardless of whether he can relay (which I doubt would actually be prevented due to their proximity) if 1 guy sees it, it's visible. It suddenly doesn't become invisible to him due to radio jamming. (this is what I meant)
      *** The Creator of Zombie Farming ***
      The KING of CoN News!!!
      The "Get off my lawn!" cranky CoN Forums Poster - not affiliated with Dorado in any way


      "Death comes to us all. Shall I deal you in?" - DoD
    • Colonel Waffles wrote:

      WalterChang wrote:

      Would Anti-air units like MAA, SAMs, Frigates (and Fighter aircraft, for that matter) be able to engage the EWA inside their AA envelope (or attack range for fast jets), given that the position of the EWA would be visible even with a jammed radar?
      No. The Jammer Symbol shows where the EWA is at any given time, but Anti-air cannot take advantage of it. You can still send things like ASF to attack it, and if a high level AWACS or MR is in range the SAM will function like normal. SAMs will be reduced to point defense.
      It’s a little odd the way units interact with it but I think it would work. This idea is very flexible, and there are a lot of details that can be added or taken away to balance it
      I'm not sure that makes a lot of sense. Why couldn't units shoot at a unit if it's in range and they know it's there? If the SAMs are guided by their radar , and that is jammed, they should have no AA defence at all, be it envelope or point . If the SAMs are heat-seeking, presumably they could just launch a missile into the sky and let it find its target (unless all their systems were jammed and they couldn't even launch)? MAA don't need radar to engage a target - they don't even have radar. So they should be able to fire at any target in range that they can see. (I would argue that high-flying Heavy-class planes should never be in range of mobile anti-air due to their altitude, but that's a different topic!)

      But I don't see why this Electronic Warfare unit should be able to stop the operator of a mobile anti-air gun from seeing a plane overhead and firing at it, if it's in range? A ship maybe would be blind, because the weapons systems operators are inside a little room below decks looking at screens, so if their systems are jammed they can't do anything at all.
    • WalterChang wrote:

      Colonel Waffles wrote:

      WalterChang wrote:

      Would Anti-air units like MAA, SAMs, Frigates (and Fighter aircraft, for that matter) be able to engage the EWA inside their AA envelope (or attack range for fast jets), given that the position of the EWA would be visible even with a jammed radar?
      No. The Jammer Symbol shows where the EWA is at any given time, but Anti-air cannot take advantage of it. You can still send things like ASF to attack it, and if a high level AWACS or MR is in range the SAM will function like normal. SAMs will be reduced to point defense.It’s a little odd the way units interact with it but I think it would work. This idea is very flexible, and there are a lot of details that can be added or taken away to balance it
      I'm not sure that makes a lot of sense. Why couldn't units shoot at a unit if it's in range and they know it's there? If the SAMs are guided by their radar , and that is jammed, they should have no AA defence at all, be it envelope or point . If the SAMs are heat-seeking, presumably they could just launch a missile into the sky and let it find its target (unless all their systems were jammed and they couldn't even launch)? MAA don't need radar to engage a target - they don't even have radar. So they should be able to fire at any target in range that they can see. (I would argue that high-flying Heavy-class planes should never be in range of mobile anti-air due to their altitude, but that's a different topic!)
      But I don't see why this Electronic Warfare unit should be able to stop the operator of a mobile anti-air gun from seeing a plane overhead and firing at it, if it's in range? A ship maybe would be blind, because the weapons systems operators are inside a little room below decks looking at screens, so if their systems are jammed they can't do anything at all.

      The part with SAMs and such wasn’t thought out very well
      I’ll update the original post
      Yee Haw
    • Colonel Waffles wrote:

      Additionally, friendly units within the radius will not be revealed by moving onto enemy territory (Or the friendly units will be visible only as unidentified armies, depending on balance needs).
      I like the idea overall, but I disagree with this bit.

      Units moving on enemy territory are not identified by radar or by military units within sight-range, so I don't think it's right that a EW unit hides their visibility.

      I'd always assumed that their presence (and formation) was reported by people who live there! I don't think you should ever be able to land your troops from ships, for example, without somebody noticing (especially in a city!).
    • I made some updates to the original post, to tweak the unit slightly

      As for the SAMs
      My reasoning is that the anti air knows that they are being jammed and from where, but they don’t exactly have the plane pin pointed on their radar. The know the location of the interference, but they don’t have eyes on the jammer. Radar is a little more accurate, being reliable enough for the enemy to get hit directly
      SAMs utilize a few different kinds of radars in their operations. You got tracking radars, targeting radars, search radars, etc. If you lose any one of these your SAMs will become less effective. A good real life example is that time an F-117 got shot down. F-117 was a powerful stealth aircraft that could perform bombing missions without risk of getting shot down. In order for the opposition to shoot one down, they first had to wait for a pause in the American radar jammer operations, and even then their radars struggled before being able to take a shot.
      It’s going to need smoothing out for sure. Adding a unit that not only takes away enemy radar but also makes your planes essentially stealth is playing with fire, and the whole direct jamming thing I added is going to help that, but I’m willing to bet people can find more holes for abuse in this thing. I’ll just wait and see so I can clean it up a bit
      Yee Haw
    • I like the ECM Unit,

      maybe some finetuning is necessary but it will add another layer to the game.
      I think the proposal fits good into concept with different siluettes for high lvl strikers beein LOW visible.
      the run between the siluette and teh radar develompent gets another aspect with this unit...

      :)
      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
      Dorado Games
      DE - Team Lead
      Conflict of Nations




      "That was not me, it was already broken!"
    • Kalrakh wrote:

      Sounds interesting, hiding them from radar could be quite strong, but hiding units from getting seen while entering a province does not make much sense und would be far to strong.

      How big is the patrol radius? Most AA units could kill it from afar, if it has a radius of 125 but a Patrol of 50
      Jammer radius is 75 (T1), 100 (T2), or 125 (T3)
      Patrol radius/ Sight range is always 25

      The logic behind the hiding in enemy territory is that, since your units are seen without enemy action, it is implied that they are being spotted by civilians and/or security in that province. By jamming communications those spotters can not let Command (you) know that there are enemies there

      I think the hiding your units is fine given the cost of the unit, the small radius and the vulnerability. I think the most concerning part is being able to shut down SAMs in certain conditions. Currently SAM+MR will not be affected by the direct jamming but if necessary SAMs can get more immunity. If it is too strong there are many opinions to better shape the balance

      Edit: I made a small fix to better balance it and give AA a chance. Jammer is inactive when on the move and not patrolling, so you cannot simply send EWA right at a SAM and jam it risk-free. The SAM must move into the jam radius or be triggered by something else for the EWA to reach it and neutralize it safely
      Yee Haw

      The post was edited 3 times, last by Colonel Waffles ().

    • I actually think things need to be rebalanced in favour of aircraft vs AA/SAMs/AA ships anyway.

      Right now, aircraft can be damaged or shot down by AA stacks or fleets without even knowing they're there, whereas AA can detect aircraft way outside their own radar range, if the radar radius of the AA overlaps with that of the planes - this can be up to 175km away, point-to-point, for Fighter planes. It's a massive disadvantage for the aircraft.

      This makes fast jets extremely vulnerable and makes using them in patrol mode over the sea or over enemy territory when you're in an active war pretty much suicidal - they just get shot down without doing any damage themselves, or even knowing from where or by what they're being engaged, aside from retrospective guess-work.

      Personally, I think the whole concept of AA envelopes needs to be revised (not abolished), but anything else that redresses the balance a bit I'm in favour of.